Tesla S first responder notes. 3000 gallons of water, 24 hours for battery fire...

[Chris Wilson]

3000 US gallons of water and up to 24 hours to extinguish a full

vehicle fire when the battery pack ignites! The UK sees 10.000

vehicle fires per annum, on average..

 

From the first responder / fire fighter notes from Tesla USA:

 

FIREFIGHTING USE WATER TO FIGHT A HIGH VOLTAGE BATTERY FIRE. If the

battery catches fire, is exposed to high heat, or is generating heat

or gases, use large amounts of water to cool the battery. It can take

approximately 3,000 gallons of water, applied directly to the battery,

to fully extinguish and cool down a battery fire; always establish or

request an additional water supply. If water is not immediately

available, use dry chemicals, CO2, foam, or another typical

fire-extinguishing agent to fight the fire until water is available.

Extinguish small fires that do not involve the high voltage battery

using typical vehicle firefighting procedures. During overhaul, do not

make contact with any high voltage components. Always use insulated

tools for overhaul. Heat and flames can compromise airbag inflators,

stored gas inflation cylinders, gas struts, and other components which

can result in an unexpected explosion. Perform an adequate knock down

before entering a hot zone. Battery fires can take up to 24 hours to

extinguish. Consider allowing the battery to burn while protecting

exposures. After all fire and smoke has visibly subsided, a thermal

imaging camera can be used to actively measure the temperature of the

high voltage battery and monitor the trend of heating or cooling.

There must not be fire, smoke, or heating present in the high voltage

battery for at least one hour before the vehicle can be released to

second responders (such as law enforcement, vehicle transporters,

etc.). The battery must be completely cooled before releasing the

vehicle to second responders or otherwise leaving the incident. Always

advise second responders that there is a risk of battery re-ignition.

Due to potential re-ignition, a Model S that has been involved in a

submersion, fire, or a collision that has compromised the high voltage

battery should be stored in an open area at least 50 ft (15 m) from

any exposure. Warning: When fire is involved, consider the entire

vehicle energized. Always wear full PPE, including a SCBA. HIGH

VOLTAGE BATTERY - FIRE DAMAGE A burning or heated battery releases

toxic vapors. These vapors may include volatile organic compounds,

hydrogen gas, carbon dioxide, carbon monoxide, soot, particulates

containing oxides of nickel, aluminum, lithium, copper, cobalt, and

hydrogen fluoride. Responders should always protect themselves with

full PPE, including a SCBA, and take appropriate measures to protect

civilians downwind from the incident. Use fog streams or

positive-pressure ventilation fans (PPV) to direct smoke and vapors.

The high voltage battery consists of lithium-ion cells. These cells

are considered dry cells. If damaged, only a small amount of fluid can

leak. Lithium-ion battery fluid is clear in color. The high voltage

battery, charge controller(s), DC-DC converter, and drive unit(s) are

liquid cooled with a typical glycol-based automotive coolant. If

damaged, this blue coolant can leak out of the high voltage battery. A

damaged high voltage battery can create rapid heating of the battery

cells. If you notice smoke coming from the high voltage battery,

assume that it is heating and take appropriate action as described in

Firefighting on page 22

[MattP]

Sounds like Fun to deal with

 

I forgot to email you aswell Chris Pads and Pins turned up a pleasure to deal with you again ....

[Dnk]

[Chris Wilson]

Just looked what a fully specced Tesla X weighs. TWO AND A HALF TONNES. Bleedin' ridiculous. Not that a Nissan Leaf is any less ludicrous at 6.5kW charge current. Just like leaving a high power shower on full whack all night. The national grid is groaning as it is, if these POS become commonplace the grid will need uprating 100% Guess who'll pay for that...? When you can store the equivalent electrical energy of a gallon of petrol or diesel in a container of the same size, weight and cost, things may become more sensible to those who are not ardent and blinkered Greens

[Frank Bullitt]

[Chris Wilson]

I wonder how much a new battery is? No doubt couched in some lease waffle, but eventually someone will need to actually buy one in the conventional manner. Do you get charged to get rid of the old one? What are the procedures to scrap a damaged Tesla? How much are the water cooled control and charging modules?

[Ric]

The outside of the car not that charred considering the massive deal they making of it.

 

New battery costs are around 10-14k

[Scooter]

The outside of the car not that charred considering the massive deal they making of it.

 

Presumably because they got there when it was smouldering and then stayed for hours to soak the battery?

[Annabella]

Beggars belief we're going this route, just take the dirty air from the cities and dump it in the country ( from the power stations for people that don't get it). Oh and imagine motorway carnage, tesla car fire M1 closed for a day....

Edited September 5, 2018 by Annabella (see edit history)

[Chris Wilson]

Tesla S rated most unreliable car in the UK was what greeted me in this morning's paper. Can't buy parts from Tesla, they won't release service information, and they won't warranty new cars used for commercial purposes. Apparently they will also not release update info on cars they sell as selected used examples, so you have no paperwork to show if the myriad of "fixes" have been carried out whilst under warranty. And the company's owner seems to be going crackers... These things will be worth zilch when out of warranty. This You Tube video makes interesting viewing what a POS these things are!

 

[Frank Bullitt]

^ All of his videos about his Tesla are interesting, it certainly opens up your eyes to potential ownership. My GP has just sold his Evo and ordered one of these.

 

At least he has deep pockets!

[Dnk]

Sadly aren't most modern cars money pits when they go out of warranty, some way worse than others

[Chris Wilson]

^ All of his videos about his Tesla are interesting, it certainly opens up your eyes to potential ownership. My GP has just sold his Evo and ordered one of these.

 

At least he has deep pockets!

 

 

I suppose it's OK as GP's no longer make house calls, so it being in the dealership or on a trailer won't matter so much

[Marcus GTE]

Thankfully I’ve not had to deal with any of these on fire yet, but I had heard they take forever to put out.

 

As much of a pain they seem to deal with in a fire scenario, I think I’d rather deal with one than an lpg conversion. I’ve seen some videos of how violently they can explode.

 

They might be as well developing a dam to go round the car and just submerge the battery pack like they used to do with acetylene cylinders.

 

I must admit I find Tesla as a company quite interesting. I find the thought of the car driving you home from the pub quite appealing.

 

Heard they would eventually like you to be able to summon the car from home. Handy for picking you up from the airport after holiday etc

[evinX]

Sadly aren't most modern cars money pits when they go out of warranty, some way worse than others

 

And that raps it all up.

[Pete]

And the company's owner seems to be going crackers...

Elon has always been a little eccentric - a fine line between genius and madness and all that.

[tintinmt]

Here are some reasons why people are buying these things at the moment:-

 

100% First Year Allowance for business owners available until April 2021

UK Plug-in Car Grant of £4,500

Reduced Employer Class 1A National Insurance Contributions (company cars only)

Exemption from London Congestion Charge

Salary sacrifice scheme available to business drivers

Significant Fuel Savings vs. a comparable Combustion Engine Car and no car fuel benefit for company cars

Significantly Reduced BiK Taxation for Company Car Drivers

Tesla Superchargers - enabling long-distance travel

Scottish customers can enjoy interest-free loans of up to £35,000 (personal) or up to £100,000 (business)

 

 

Basically, the UK taxpayer is subsidising them. I have no idea why the Scots should be allowed interest free loans.

[Konrad]

As much of a pain they seem to deal with in a fire scenario, I think I’d rather deal with one than an lpg conversion. I’ve seen some videos of how violently they can explode.

 

 

If you've seen violent explosion of LPG converted car it means someone screwed up installation. If it is done right, release valve will burn all the gas without anything close to explosion.

[Marcus GTE]

If you've seen violent explosion of LPG converted car it means someone screwed up installation. If it is done right, release valve will burn all the gas without anything close to explosion.

 

I suppose that’s always going to be a potential problem with them isn’t it. Depends if the conversion was done properly or not.

 

I saw elon musks interview last night on Joe Rohan’s podcast on YouTube. He was interesting.

 

He said we are already cyborgs if you count how connected we are to our phones.

[BoGlE]

Beggars belief we're going this route, just take the dirty air from the cities and dump it in the country ( from the power stations for people that don't get it). Oh and imagine motorway carnage, tesla car fire M1 closed for a day....

Was that a joke?

 

 

[Annabella]

Which bit?

[Pete]

Which bit?

I'd imagine the bit about dumping dirty air into the country. I think maybe there wasn't a realisation that what you meant was it is a bad idea to build more dirty power stations to make cities cleaner.

[Annabella]

I'd imagine the bit about dumping dirty air into the country. I think maybe there wasn't a realisation that what you meant was it is a bad idea to build more dirty power stations to make cities cleaner.

 

Yep that. Can see how it reads two ways.

[BoGlE]

My bad. Yes terrible idea. The fact that there's the technology out there to do much much better is quite depressing

 

 

[Scooter]

Devils advocate (almost hate myself for saying it) but isn't the point that hypothetically if a new power station was built that ran on Hydrocarbons produced electricity for 'x' number of cars, then the electric cars could do more miles for the same amount of hydrocarbons burnt? So more efficient use of energy (IC engine is known to be poor) while at the same time the emissions from the one power station source can be more strictly controlled than the individual 'x' cars with 'maps', decats, or simply worn out.

 

So cleaner and more efficient in principle and then if you can increase the greener/low emission power sources you'll 'win' even more?