Nathan

Bugger..you're Ian not Adam. Sorry. Why do I always get you two mixed up? Similar humour/writing I feel. Cheers, Nathan TDI PLC

Right, the following could be complete pants, but without going back to the deepest darkest depths of my memory I think it works like this: Your above example is good. There will be a pressure drop. Although for arguments sake the car will be making the same power because theres the same amount of air molecules, just at a lower pressure. Now, as most turbos use some form of pressure-controlled wastegate, turbine rpm will increase to 'make up' for the pressure that has been lost due to cooling. This isn't actually as bad as it sounds as most of us aren't using our turbos at max rpm (unless your Mk4 is making 1.4 bar on the stock IC..). And it is this which increases power for the same given boost level. Ta'daa! Thats why I said that your car doesn't make sense. The boost controller should see the pressure drop and adjust the wastgate accordingly, thus giving you the 'free' increased power which is the reason why we all fit uprated intercoolers. Now, continually increasing turbine rpm isn't ideal. It's better than using more and more boost to make hot air though, as worn turbos are preferable to worn turbos and detted engines. So now we start talking bigger turbos. We reduce the turbine speed AND use a decent intercooler to give us the best of both worlds, and you are now likely to be at the stage where you are actually making more power at less boost. You are simply shifting so much cold air. This is why a big twin can make 550bhp at 1.4 bar whilst a stock-turboed car will make less than that at 1.5 bar. Your boost controller sounds like pants mate. Sorry. Unless it's an air density-detecting one which would be pretty flash...you haven't been knocking something up in your lab have you....;-) Like I said I if anyone knows better please stand up. Cheers! Nathan TDI PLC

Yep, I would agree with Darren. Only one point I would raise is that if you CAN hear det on a Mk4 with the naked ear you are well on your way to meltdown. Believe it or not, 'det cans' (a stethoscope with a bit of metal at the end to attach it to the block) are still widely used by a lot of tuners and engine dyno operators today, and do work very well. In conjunction with a piezo unit as a backup, the two combined are exactly what we use here. Cheers Nathan TDI PLC

Yes. You would still have to have a wastegate operating to some degree though but I'd be nit-picking. Say Car 1 has a manifold pressure of 1 bar at a temperature of 100 deg. C. And say Car 2 has a manifold pressure of 1 bar at a temperature of 25 deg C. Car 2 has many molecules of oxygen available to burn than car 1, hence the possibility of more power, even though they are at the same pressure. The nitpicking comes in because if you welded the wastegates wide open, Car 2 would make more power therefore more volume of exhaust gas and therefore spin the turbos faster, which without wastegate control could get out of hand. I know you said 'no boost creep' but if one Car1 was holding one bar the same setup on Car2 wouldn't. Going back to your car, I'm not too sure why your boost will have dropped. Most boost controllers only take manifold pressure into account, irrespective of air density. Maybe you have reached the limit of something else: turbo/wategate/boost control design? Cheers, Nathan TDI PLC

Correct. Many people cannot comprehend the fact the the same car can make more power on less boost. You seem to have cracked it. Cheers, Nathan TDI PLC edited to say I was actually agreeing with Steve....eyefi slipped one in while I wasn't looking...

Oooh....my blow-off orifice is bigger thans yours.... I presume the Blitz ones are still push type then? Must admit I do prefer pull type as you know they will never open under boost. Not unless they break in half anyway.....that wasn't what happened to your HKS one was it?....gulp... Cheers, Nathan TDI PLC

Like the HKS SQV's have had for the last 7 years then...... Hi Terry, nice to see you back Nathan TDI PLC

About 750-800 should be fine on the road. HKS use the triples on the 1000bhp drag skylines. Cheers, Nathan TDI PLC

Hi, Don't know if it's any help to anyone but the HKS twin plates have come on remarkably in the last year. The latest 'GD Pro' range really are pussycats to live with. They have this funky sprin-thing going on which not only keeps the plates under tension whilst dis-engaged (so they don't rattle) but they also engage the plates sequentially so you don't get the 'grab' usually associated with multiplates. Believe me, I used to hate multiplates with a vengeance but now I'd happily live with the HKS one. Not trying the hard sell but if anyone wanted first-hand experience then give me your email and I will let you know when we have fitted the one we are doing in a few months. You are welcome to come down and I'll put you in the driving seat so you can feel the pedal pressure too. There will be some cheesewire round your throat to make sure you don't drive off... Cheers, Nathan TDI PLC

Ah, I didn't realise that 200SX engines worked on a different internal combustion priciple.... Seriously, yes, we do quite a few 200SX's. Did one the other day that you might know; red one, S14 (early) with HKS manifold, FMIC, bigger injectors, HKS cams, HKS FCON etc. Auto. Owned by Ken Scudder. Apparantly in the 200SX club. Real nice guy and the car went like stink afterwards by all accounts. I think it made around 250~260bhp at the wheels. On a stock-based hybrid T28. And an auto! Class quote Ian. The UK spec measures O2 level before and after the second cat. Remove it entirely and you will get ECU code storages as well as other closed loop gremlins. In fact, even though you would be checking WOT fuelling I wouldn't rule out that a removed O2 sensor could affect the readings in some way, even if it's because of a stored fault code on the fuelling side which may make the ECU revert to a 'safer' side of the map. Not quite limp-home but it may well do something else... But I'm sure your man knows better... Cheers, Nathan TDI PLC

Why? In fact, forget that, we're obviously doing it wrong. Must remember to keep my mouth shut... The second sensor is there because..... ......damn, no-one listens to me anyway...

Alternatively, mount the sensor at right angle in the middle of a length of say, 1 foot long pipe, 1.5" bore. 1' then goes up the exhaust, the other foot sticks out the back of the car. Unless you've got airleaks in the system (which you shouldn't have if the car uses lambdas) you will get a perfectly good reading and is easily transferred from car to car. Regards, Nathan TDI PLC

Hi Keith, We all know that the stock UK pump is better than the Jap one, but then most UK cars are on twice the mileage so it doesn't mean a lot. Personally I would fit an uprated pump, period. Jap or UK spec. OK, makes it inactive but having it permanently down isn't a hardship for a lot of people. The reduction of airflow over the stock aircon and water rads won't be a problem for 99.9% of the people on this board. I'm sure theres past threads on this that I have posted before. In short, yes, it can be a real bastard. Or, it can be a 20 minute job. All depends on whether the fittings are siezed into the filter, which is why we also keep the fuel lines in stock if needed. And no, we don't cut them off with oxy-acet ;-) Do you know what my advice would be? Bearing in mind you don't have to have a rolling road or any other expensive machinery I would suggest that 100 members on this board chip in £10 each and buy a group MoTec system. Install the sensor into a custom-made pipe like we have and you can then swop it between cars easily. To be honest I'm surprised that none of you have done it before. I appreciate that it wouldn't really work if no-one knew each other and might mis-use the equipment but theres a lot of long-term members on here that know each other pretty well, and I'm sure it would be looked after. JB could be the official 'owner' and sign it in and out as necessary. Just a thought. Timing is usually fine. Only really needs fiddling with on non-stock turbo setups. Or I should say, the cost is only really justified on non stock turbo setups. Cheers Nathan TDI PLC

My 2p. I agree with Chris. Many Mk4's are showing signs of fin errosion on the stock cooler, and we all know that this is a bad thing. I also think that having the OPTION of a replacement SMIC is good for those that simply do not want an FMIC. Personally, for the price difference, (against an HKS S type at say £880.00) fitting a FMIC would be a no-brainer for me but I digress. I would want to be investigating the 'blow-up' situation a little more first. Yes, theres has been more than a few Supra engines going melt-down over the past couple of years but IMO it's more due to the sheer amount of them now and the fact that so many private individuals are fiddling with them that have not got the means to check the final setup. How many people on this board check fuelling after doing a full decat? Or even after a 'regular' 1.2 bar conversion? I'd wager that most of you are still on the stock pumps. Pumps which were barely adequate when new, let alone now with some at 10 years old. What about injector spray patterns? Blocked fuel filters? The list goes on. We fit an uprated pump with every single 1.2 bar conversion now. Paranoid? Or is it that we know the data? Personally I would be more interested in making sure that my actual conversion was right before being worried about some corroded fins... Regards Nathan TDI PLC

Hijacker! Where did that come from?! Don't worry, I will consider lowering our rates so that we can attract more customers like yourself.... Sorry, how much was your piece of right-angle pipe and 2 small pieces of hose again....? Cheers Nathan TDI PLC

D'ya want me to dial the number for you too...? About 40 quid I think. Mind you, Tweeks do have a fair old markup so make that nearer 80.... Cheers, Nathan TDI PLC

I didn't say NO cams, I said HKS ones..... Distributor....... Personally I would enjoy the car for what it is but for the odd occasion I would still gas it, no question. 50bhp or so. As for our Mk4 NA page, I know it's wrong. Will be rectified as soon as I get the chance. Cheers, Nathan TDI PLC

Demon Tweeks in Wales (thats in England BTW) can supply one too. Cheers, Nathan TDI PLC

In light of Ians post giving me something to laugh about (gotta be some good to come out of this thread I think I will also join him on the bench. Thankyou, and goodnight. Anyone fancy a pint? Cheers, Nathan TDI PLC

Hi David, Seeing as I'm a nice chap and even though it's pretty clear you would not be buying HKS from us I can't bear to see anyone getting striped up or making a faux pas. Assuming '264' means those manufactured by HKS, do not buy them. They will not work. Neither will any other profile. Cheers, Nathan TDI PLC

With all due respect I am most certainly not getting confused and in light of that being the second comment you have made about me not understanding I will again post what you wrote: The quote above, without the controls you only now mention in your most recent posts such as 'redundant' heat, etc, can be interpretated in many ways and I would wager the most common being that people would assume that removing heat from the brake is pointless, which we all know is wrong. Like Gareth says I think that we all know how it works AJI but, and I mean this in the nicest way, I personally think your explanations can be confusing. Again, without you adding 'unless the brakes are overheating' to your quote above it is indeed, wrong. Regards, Nathan TDI PLC

Agreed. You deffo don't want to be doing this mod on a car thats already mapped for 95+ RON. OK, you might get a gain on a UK spec if used in conjunction with 97 RON but most of that headroom left in terms of det is used up when you do a boost upgrade anyway so you're better off doing that than playing with resistors etc. Forget it. Regards, Nathan TDIPLC

Again, the recent posts are waaaayy off track. We all know that brakes have a limited operating temperature. We all know that slotted are best for longevity. We all know that the best cross-drilled discs have the holes cast in them (like Brembo). The crunch was when AJI posted this: So, why do we cross-drill discs? In fact, why do we even bother using ventilated ones? If friction is finite, and is entirely reliant on heat, why do we want to take the heat away.....? The answer is dissipation. Yes, we all want friction, but we also want to get rid of the by-product: heat. Holes and vents do that, allowing the friction to remain the same rather than mounting up and cooking the brakes. So, by reducing the generated heat you are certainly NOT reducing the friction, as was stated. Wow. Summed up in one paragraph. Regards, Nathan TDI PLC

Or.......what offset have you got on the wheels you have? It's usually on the wheel somewhere. Cheers, Nathan TDI PLC

OK, from another angle: Are you then saying that cross-drilling a like for like disc will do nothing to improve braking whatsoever, because both will only generate X amount of friction (thus heat) before failing. In fact, in your opinion, cross-drilling a like for like disc will actually reduce the available braking power, due to less surface area? In addition, according to you, throwing in the gassing of pads doesn't bear any weight either because you say that heat is heat, and if a pad starts to gas on either a solid or a cross-drilled disc then the friction is still the same, and if it doesn't gas on the drilled disc then it by definition must be making less friction, thus meaning the drilled disc is LESS effective. This example is good because it also takes into account all temperatures, right up to and including failing. Using your theory, the heat generation is always relative to the braking effort so doing anything to reduce heat is futile. This is what you are saying, yes? Regards, Nathan TDI PLC