Phil Wall Posted August 23, 2001 Author Share Posted August 23, 2001 While you are talking to RL you might mention how out of date the software is and its lack of compatibility with many modern laptops. I had to try three to get it to work in my car. Don’t expect much for your money, when you get the kit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Wall Posted August 23, 2001 Author Share Posted August 23, 2001 Flavio, I was just going to suggest a meet to help you set up your RLTC. But then checked your profile, might be just a bit too far.:biggrin: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted August 24, 2001 Share Posted August 24, 2001 With the TC removal kit fitted the car does seem a bit livelier, it has none of the restricted feeling that you get with the TC on. As for more power - hard to say really, feels better though. The removal kit will come into it's own though when my Racelogic TC goes on as it will remove the stock TC's ability to intefere when the Racelogic is deliberately allowing slip. Cheers, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pog Posted September 20, 2001 Share Posted September 20, 2001 FAO Phil Wall I really need a copy of your RLTC fitting notes if you could please e-mail me them on: [email protected] I would be most grateful. Thanks. JAP Auto TT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Wall Posted September 20, 2001 Author Share Posted September 20, 2001 OK but it will take a while. Can't remember which computers it is on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich J Posted September 20, 2001 Share Posted September 20, 2001 Phil did you ever get the software running on your USB only PC? I have suggesfully used HyperTerm to access the RLTC, so hopefully a USB to COM port converter should allow you to access it. I'm also currently constructing an interface to run it via my Handspring Visor PDA but that's another story (involving a little box of tricks to convert TTL to RS232). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pog Posted September 20, 2001 Share Posted September 20, 2001 Thanks Phil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Booth Posted September 20, 2001 Share Posted September 20, 2001 Quote: from HardHead42 on 10:29 pm on Sep. 20, 2001[br]Phil did you ever get the software running on your USB only PC? I have suggesfully used HyperTerm to access the RLTC, so hopefully a USB to COM port converter should allow you to access it. I'm also currently constructing an interface to run it via my Handspring Visor PDA but that's another story (involving a little box of tricks to convert TTL to RS232). It's called a 'chip' Rich. Every manufacturer has a single chip RS232 driver, including the charge pump to give you the +/- 12V. Stick it on a piece of Veroboard and Bob's your uncle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich J Posted September 20, 2001 Share Posted September 20, 2001 Quote: from Paul Booth on 11:16 pm on Sep. 20, 2001[br]Quote: from HardHead42 on 10:29 pm on Sep. 20, 2001[br]Phil did you ever get the software running on your USB only PC? I have suggesfully used HyperTerm to access the RLTC, so hopefully a USB to COM port converter should allow you to access it. I'm also currently constructing an interface to run it via my Handspring Visor PDA but that's another story (involving a little box of tricks to convert TTL to RS232). It's called a 'chip' Rich. Every manufacturer has a single chip RS232 driver, including the charge pump to give you the +/- 12V. Stick it on a piece of Veroboard and Bob's your uncle. LOL, I know I have a Max233 TTL to RS232 converter chip in front of me this minute, just got to wire it up and add a 5v supply (niether the RLTC or the PDA have a supply) from few batteries (I have been told it will owrk on a 4.5v supply). probably fix it all up this week end, worst thing is I'm going to have to canabalize a 20 quid Visor Edge USB cable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Wall Posted September 21, 2001 Author Share Posted September 21, 2001 Quote: from HardHead42 on 10:29 pm on Sep. 20, 2001[br]Phil did you ever get the software running on your USB only PC? I have suggesfully used HyperTerm to access the RLTC, so hopefully a USB to COM port converter should allow you to access it. No I never did, as RLTC is MSDOS based, I believe, and USB is only functional in win98+, the USB does FA in DOS. Gave up an nicked my wifes lap top. But if you have a solution and could make something work for me. let me know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Booth Posted September 21, 2001 Share Posted September 21, 2001 Quote: from HardHead42 on 11:33 pm on Sep. 20, 2001[br]Quote: from Paul Booth on 11:16 pm on Sep. 20, 2001[br]Quote: from HardHead42 on 10:29 pm on Sep. 20, 2001[br]Phil did you ever get the software running on your USB only PC? I have suggesfully used HyperTerm to access the RLTC, so hopefully a USB to COM port converter should allow you to access it. I'm also currently constructing an interface to run it via my Handspring Visor PDA but that's another story (involving a little box of tricks to convert TTL to RS232). It's called a 'chip' Rich. Every manufacturer has a single chip RS232 driver, including the charge pump to give you the +/- 12V. Stick it on a piece of Veroboard and Bob's your uncle. LOL, I know I have a Max233 TTL to RS232 converter chip in front of me this minute, just got to wire it up and add a 5v supply (niether the RLTC or the PDA have a supply) from few batteries (I have been told it will owrk on a 4.5v supply). probably fix it all up this week end, worst thing is I'm going to have to canabalize a 20 quid Visor Edge USB cable. Surely you can find some cheap jobby from PC World for about a fiver? BTW, if you're using external batteries, don't forget to make your RS232 converter ground same as your PDA ground, you don't want it floating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich J Posted September 22, 2001 Share Posted September 22, 2001 Unfortunately not, most I have seen have been over the 40 quid mark and still require a cable for the PDA and an external power supply, and not the sort of thing you can get at PCWorld. the Chip was only 4 quid so will cost me about 20 to make the box (chip, connectors, battery holders etc) plus the cable. Not looking like I will be getting round to it until next week now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Wall Posted September 24, 2001 Author Share Posted September 24, 2001 I am now looking for a really cheap lap top to run in the car, as I want to do some tweeking of the system. If I find one without a battery could any of you wizards make me a power supply to run from the fag lighter for track days and road racing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich J Posted September 24, 2001 Share Posted September 24, 2001 No I never did, as RLTC is MSDOS based, I believe, and USB is only functional in win98+, the USB does FA in DOS. Gave up an nicked my wifes lap top. But if you have a solution and could make something work for me. let me know. You CAN use HyperTerm to access the RLTC via Windows, as to whether you can get it to see a USB to COM port box is another matter (I presume you get drivers with these converters though to make it look like a COM port). The RLTC is basically just running ASCII text on an RS232 link, is very simple (doesn't even use hardware or software flow control) Try it with Hyperterm in Windows it should work, just copy the data rate settings on PROCOMM. (Edited by HardHead42 at 10:50 pm on Sep. 24, 2001) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Wall Posted September 24, 2001 Author Share Posted September 24, 2001 Quote: from HardHead42 on 10:47 pm on Sep. 24, 2001[br]No I never did, as RLTC is MSDOS based, I believe, and USB is only functional in win98+, the USB does FA in DOS. Gave up an nicked my wifes lap top. But if you have a solution and could make something work for me. let me know. You CAN use HyperTerm to access the RLTC via windows, as to weather you can get it to see a USB to COM box is another matter (I presume you get drivers with these converters though). The RLTC is basically just running ASCII text on an RS232 link, is very simple (doesn't even use hardware or software flow control) try it with Hyperterm in Windows it should work, just copy the data rate settings on PROCOMM. That’s what I love about this BBS sooner or later some one comes along with the answer. But there is a slight snag! Ok, I know where to plug things in, I can turn it on and off and make it do stuff, but when it comes to tech talk on computers, on the evolutionary scale I have just crawled out of the swamp. Or about at Sinclair level. I may need help to do what you have suggested, and if it does not work I won’t have a clue what to do next. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Booth Posted October 1, 2001 Share Posted October 1, 2001 I just had a nice chat with the nice technical people at Racelogic (really, really nice people). Got the full breakdown on how the control pot behaves, how the software sees the launch control button on an analogue input line, and what you can do with it all. Basically, as I commented earlier, it's just a resistor stack with as many tap point sas you want. If you have an auto gearbox, you can't take advantage of the launch control so that's a redundant button. The adjust knob is black and in a dark car you can't tell at a glance what it's set to. You can take the resistor steps to the extreme, i.e., an infinite series or a "variable resistor" as it's more commonly known Make that pot a slider, mount it in one of the existing button holes, give it a chrome or polished Ali knob and you can see how far across it is at a glance. You also get infinitely variable traction control, if that's of interest to you. I think you're more likely to move it to 1/4, 1/2, 3/4 and 'full' positions in practice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Wall Posted October 1, 2001 Author Share Posted October 1, 2001 Is it in your car yet Paul? I agree the RL guys are very very helpful, when I had a similar chat with them. They even did an analysis if one of my RL files, produced by the car to confirm it was OK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Booth Posted October 1, 2001 Share Posted October 1, 2001 Quote: from Phil Wall on 11:19 am on Oct. 1, 2001[br]Is it in your car yet Paul? I agree the RL guys are very very helpful, when I had a similar chat with them. They even did an analysis if one of my RL files, produced by the car to confirm it was OK It was going to be this last weekend but: 1. Couldn't find the control pot. (Wife 'found' it eventually, tidied away, claims she dind't touch it) 2. Was going to combine ripping carpet up with Pete B going down to scope the SLD. His mum was over so he was not allowed to come out and play. Seems silly to take the carpet up twice. Doing it next weekend now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Wall Posted October 1, 2001 Author Share Posted October 1, 2001 Ok Paul, Your excuses are acceptable.:biggrin: We will have to wait until next week to hear how it goes, and your impressions of the system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Branners Posted October 1, 2001 Share Posted October 1, 2001 Quote: from Paul Booth on 10:51 am on Oct. 1, 2001[br] If you have an auto gearbox, you can't take advantage of the launch control so that's a redundant button. The adjust knob is black and in a dark car you can't tell at a glance what it's set to. Im interested in that you say the launch cannot be fitted to an auto. Is that a technical reason? I planned on left foot braking and having the launch hold the revs at about 2000rpm while I have my foot flat on the floor. What is the reason for the launch not working on an auto? JB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Booth Posted October 1, 2001 Share Posted October 1, 2001 Quote: from branners on 12:11 pm on Oct. 1, 2001[br]Quote: from Paul Booth on 10:51 am on Oct. 1, 2001[br] If you have an auto gearbox, you can't take advantage of the launch control so that's a redundant button. The adjust knob is black and in a dark car you can't tell at a glance what it's set to. Im interested in that you say the launch cannot be fitted to an auto. Is that a technical reason? I planned on left foot braking and having the launch hold the revs at about 2000rpm while I have my foot flat on the floor. What is the reason for the launch not working on an auto? JB Oh you can fit it, but my understanding is that the launch control holds the revs at maximum power, i.e., acts as both a rev limiter and prevents the wheels from spinning more than the optimum for the surface (10% in dry). I also understand that you have to feed the clutch in gradually as the TC can't prevent the engine getting swamped and dropping off peak power. The ECTS ECU (Engine ECU), or torque converter, holds the engine at 2,000 RPM and the RL TC just prevents more than 10% slip once the engine builds up enough revs to break the back end away. So you *have* an inefficient launch control built in. What do you want the extra launch button for? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Branners Posted October 1, 2001 Share Posted October 1, 2001 but doesnt the launch control just hold the revs at the required setting (4000rpm for a manual) and allows you to have your foot flat on the floor, and then once you launch it just releases the rev limit and tries to control the slip? In other words the launch button just holds the revs at 4000rpm and the traction control does the rest? JB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Booth Posted October 1, 2001 Share Posted October 1, 2001 On a manual if you floor it with the RL TC holding the revs at 4,000 and you just dump the clutch, you're likely to break something or stall the engine. My understanding is you have to feed the clutch and the TC ensures you don't over rev. RL's graphs say optimum optimum griup is achieved at 10% slip so that't what you's get, whatever the engine tried to do with the back-end while the car is putting out maximum power. So the RL TC balances the revs and slip but it can't generate extra BHP. On the auto, if you left foot brake, you can't get more than 2,00 RPM with your foot flat down on the loud pedal, so setting the RL TC to limit the RPM to 2,000 is belts and braces. Once the car is rolling and the revs move up into the maximum power area, if you get rear wheel slip the RL TC will control it to 10% (or whatever you've set it to). So you didn't need the extra button setting the RPM to 2,000 as well as the inherent limitation. (Edited by Paul Booth at 2:04 pm on Oct. 1, 2001) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Supragirl Posted October 1, 2001 Share Posted October 1, 2001 Well my experience on the manual system is as follows:- when the RL button is pressed down..car is in 1st..clutch down and foot flat down on the accelerator pedal...engine revs no higher than 4,000 RPM (or whatever you have set it to) when ready simply lift foot off clutch...(fast as you like) and hold on for dear life!!!!!!!!!!!! Didn't break anything... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Booth Posted October 1, 2001 Share Posted October 1, 2001 Quote: from Paul Booth on 2:03 pm on Oct. 1, 2001[br]"you're likely to break something" I wonder how many times it will stand that. Would you like to do the destruction testing on our behalf, although it sounds as though you already are Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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