JamieP Posted November 1, 2009 Author Share Posted November 1, 2009 I don't want to get into an arguement over the internet Im not looking for an argument, im just asking why he thinks its junk? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowboy bebop Posted November 1, 2009 Share Posted November 1, 2009 I know Jamie, I wasn't meaning you mate, I just know that threads like these turn into arguements. Chris is entitled to his opinion much like everyone else is, but I fail to see why he honestly thinks his $20,000 motor is jusnk when (1) he's trying to sell it on, and (2) he only went so far as to have the motor delivered to shop who has his car. It's hard to label a motor junk when the motor is brand new and never even been turned over, much less never even been seen first hand by the person labeling it junk in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuindustries Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 I'll add a couple things: 1.) I have personally seen this motor. I traveled to Winter Park, FL on March 19 of this year and saw firsthand the motor and the tight clearances it had in my engine bay, including the driver's side exhaust manifold sitting on the frame rail. My primary concern from the time I agreed to purchase this motor and turbo package was how everything would co-exist in those tight quarters from a heat perspective. Once the motor was put in my car and the shop got a chance to look at cowboy bebop's car and motor in their facility, we had discussions on how to proceed with the build. At the end of the day, I didn't have confidence that my original concerns could adequately be addressed, so I pulled the plug and am going back to the 2JZ. 2.) I am labeling the motor as worthless precisely because I am trying to sell the motor/turbo package. I can't in good conscience advertise the motor as being worth anything to potential purchasers under the following conditions: * The only other example of this motor/turbo combo being swapped into the MKIV chassis has a documented max dyno of 380 RWHP on Q16 fuel, a number easily attainable with the 2JZ-GTE on stock twins with BPU upgrades on pump 93 US fuel. I have not seen an answer to the question of why the motor has not been tuned for high boost that would satisfy a serious potential purchaser. * After being prominently documented, for all intents and purposes advertised, on Supraforums.com for close to three years, all information on the aforementioned car and motor was deleted from the primary forum in the US for anyone interested in this motor swap. No public reason was given on that forum. * The aforementioned car was put up for sale in September on Supraforums.com and on eBay. When questions were asking about why the motor had only been tuned for low boost, if overheating concerns were valid, and why the car was being sold after such a long and public build, the for sale thread was deleted. No public reason was given on that forum. * Comments on Supraforums.com regarding the motor in cowboy bebop's car open questions about the design and build quality on my motor. See here, here, and here. * Given the lack of documented success in producing high HP from this motor swap into the MKIV chassis, I would have to spend at the minimum an additional ±$10K USD (on top of the ±$26K USD already spent on the motor, turbo kit, and ECU) to get it running and tuned in my car to demonstrate the value of the motor to a potential purchaser. There is no value in that to me. That being said, the motor may work for whomever buys it, I can't say with certainty one way or another. But I also can't point to anything that would assure a potential purchaser of what they are getting; without that, the motor has essentially no value. So I am selling the turbo kit for a reasonable price, ±$3000 USD, and the motor comes with it as a throw-away. If it works, great; if not, they have no beef with me as I didn't (and couldn't) warrant anything regarding the motor. Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz6002 Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 What torque did the car make when it made 380bhp? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowboy bebop Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 Like 365ft/lbs of the top of my head. We're starting to recover so I am anticipating another dyno session soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz6002 Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 Like 365ft/lbs of the top of my head. We're starting to recover so I am anticipating another dyno session soon. Look forward to seeing and hearing it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowboy bebop Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 Thanks mate, here a short video I took not too long ago if you want to hear it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michel lane Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 $3000 for this package !!! how much would it cost to deliver to the uk ?...yes iam serious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 I would be too Michel, even just for a project to mess around with on an engine stand that would be worth a punt. Absolute bargain, can't believe it hasn't been snapped up. Probably around £300-£500 sheets to get shipped over. Might be cheaper ways of doing it though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnny g Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 I would be in for this at that price as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamieP Posted November 2, 2009 Author Share Posted November 2, 2009 You guys have read the thread on supraforum? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian W Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 You guys have read the thread on supraforum? I'm sensing a tone that means no, they probably haven't? What's the gist, Jamie? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnny g Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 Nah ... should we? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamieP Posted November 2, 2009 Author Share Posted November 2, 2009 If you are considering buying i would read that thread first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustGav Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 You guys have read the thread on supraforum? Nah ... should we? It does make an interesting read and raise some very interesting questions regarding the work done on the engine build in the bits I read. I am sure there is more information available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 I did, seems that the engine could be put right with a head rebuild and some checks on the piston sizes. Would be a big job to get the cooling working properly. I don't have the spare money to throw at it, or the space to take on a project of that size, but if I did I would definitely be interested. The turbo's and kit are most of the way there. The engine needs a bit of work and a lot of checks done to make sure its fit for purpose and the shoehorning job along with the cooling and space issues is going to be a bitch. Thats what projects are all about though. Call it 2.5k to the UK, your brakes were more than that Jamie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnny g Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 It is a bit of an interesting read that... Not ruled it out, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustGav Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 I did, seems that the engine could be put right with a head rebuild and some checks on the piston sizes. Not so sure a head rebuild would actually help... There are some interesting claims as to work regarding the porting and polishing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 Not so sure a head rebuild would actually help... There are some interesting claims as to work regarding the porting and polishing. Sorry thats what i meant. Re-porting and re-polishing it. I know that there might be a few issues with the head... but its a free engine. Even if it was 100% totally useless as an engine it would make a cracking coffee table. I don't think the engine is un-salvageable. Thats basically all I mean. For the money involved it's a bargain, as long as the turbo's are good lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustGav Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 Sorry thats what i meant. Re-porting and re-polishing it. I know that there might be a few issues with the head... but its a free engine. Even if it was 100% totally useless as an engine it would make a cracking coffee table. I don't think the engine is un-salvageable. Thats basically all I mean. For the money involved it's a bargain, as long as the turbo's are good lol. No, re-porting and re-polishing are out the question if indeed there is some basis to the work problems. It has been suggested that perhaps a little TOO much material has been removed.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamieP Posted November 2, 2009 Author Share Posted November 2, 2009 (edited) Call it 2.5k to the UK, your brakes were more than that Jamie. Say its needs new heads and a full rebuild? add that to the what would be a rather large install cost and without knowing if it will even work in a supra well (sorry but cowboys very short low boost video proves nothing to me) and it could work out to cost a massive amount of money and be a real pita. Even the owner thats trying to sell the engine labels it as Junk, big risk imo. Cowboy bepop seems a nice fella to me, ive loved reading his build thread and he has always conducted himself in a good manor, but deleting all the posts and pics on supraforum and not answering any questions has done his rep for himself or the products he is selling no good imo. I just dont want you guys to get stung:) Edited November 2, 2009 by JamieP (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 I agree but i'm talking about a long term project where you carry all the work out on your own. I'm not talking about buying it and fitting it in a matter of weeks/months. I'm talking months/years. Take your car for example, your supra is your toy and you treat it as such. You must be close to 40k on the car by now are you not? It has to be a hobby and cash that is purely used for pleasure (other than the hooker money). Take this engine and spend some money on a facelift N/A 6spd that leaves you around 34k to get it done. If i didn't have change from 34k after getting that engine into a supra I would be worried. I would be expecting to have 20k worth of toys to go in along with the supra in fact. Look at the people who are genuinely interested. They will be carrying out any of the work themselves. Most likely on a supra sitting in the back corner getting worked on for a few hours a week. Could be wrong, but that would be my intention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdMorris Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 I hope I have no cause for concern..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowboy bebop Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 I'd sooner pull them from Supraforums than my products be accused of what they are being acused of. No matter what I say or do it will never be good enough it seems, so yes, I decided to pull the threads and offer no more dealings with SF. It's my fault for being honest in what it takes to do a build, but I try an disclose both the easy parts and the hurdles to overcome. That's a damn sight more than a lot of other poeple would do. For what it's worth Jamie, I've answered question since 2006 regarding the builds, and even today (this day) take phone calls on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamieP Posted November 2, 2009 Author Share Posted November 2, 2009 (edited) I agree but i'm talking about a long term project where you carry all the work out on your own. I'm not talking about buying it and fitting it in a matter of weeks/months. I'm talking months/years. Take your car for example, your supra is your toy and you treat it as such. You must be close to 40k on the car by now are you not? It has to be a hobby and cash that is purely used for pleasure (other than the hooker money). Take this engine and spend some money on a facelift N/A 6spd that leaves you around 34k to get it done. If i didn't have change from 34k after getting that engine into a supra I would be worried. I would be expecting to have 20k worth of toys to go in along with the supra in fact. Look at the people who are genuinely interested. They will be carrying out any of the work themselves. Most likely on a supra sitting in the back corner getting worked on for a few hours a week. Could be wrong, but that would be my intention. Months/years sounds like agro to me:D I dont see where my car or what ive spent has anything to do with this tbh. If anyone takes this on i hope it works out for them, this is my last post in this thread. Edited November 2, 2009 by JamieP (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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