Supragal Posted August 26, 2008 Share Posted August 26, 2008 Did anyone see this last week? I watched it on iplayer last night. Disgusted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorin Posted August 26, 2008 Share Posted August 26, 2008 Didn't see it, I presume from your response it was about how the "Breed Standard" is crippling dogs? Modern day German Shepherds being a particular example! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R Black Posted August 26, 2008 Share Posted August 26, 2008 I was told about this program, people breed animals to thier own requirements, regardless of how bad it is for the animal. I just started keeping Koi & apparently they used to be very anal with the breeding of these, personally would rather a healthy dog than one that could'nt breathe properly or was going to get bad back legs all so it could be best of show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supragal Posted August 26, 2008 Author Share Posted August 26, 2008 Yes it was about that. Have a watch on iplayer. Some of it is horrendous. There was footage of a boxer with Epilepsy fitting, it actually made me cry. The King Charles are one of the worst apparently. Just rolling about screaming in pain. These dogs are actually winning show and qualifying for crufts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
n boost Posted August 26, 2008 Share Posted August 26, 2008 It is sick tbh but we sadly live in a world full of double standards and gov'ts/people interested in making money over anything else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazboy Posted August 26, 2008 Share Posted August 26, 2008 I bet the BBC still show Crufts next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorin Posted August 26, 2008 Share Posted August 26, 2008 I bet the BBC still show Crufts next year. And I bet they still have that twat Ben Fogle presenting it again too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pixelfill Posted August 26, 2008 Share Posted August 26, 2008 Yeah I saw it and was outraged. Particularly with the Rhodesian Ridgeback club. I can't believe that the distinctive ridge is actually a form of spina bifida (sp?) and that the club are selectively breeding to maintain it. Any dogs born without the ridge should be "culled" (the words of the kennel club). To make matters worse it seems there is a genetic defect in Rhodesians which doesn't appear in the ridgeless dogs, whereby there is an open channel from the skin surface all the way to the dogs spine which can lead to some nasty infections. Then the whole issue of mother-son, father-daughter, brother-sister breeding. None of the pedigree breeders they interviewed saw this as a problem. Apparently it's "completely different" to incest. How? I have to say I really felt for the King Charles Spaniels plight. I can't believe that a dog with this genetic affliction could win best in breed. The owner's reaction when questioned about it said everything imho. I've completely lost all faith in the Pedigree dog world, and have decided that should I get a dog I'll be looking for a Rhodesian Ridgelessback out of principle. I've always liked Rhodies anyway. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pixelfill Posted August 26, 2008 Share Posted August 26, 2008 Didn't see it, I presume from your response it was about how the "Breed Standard" is crippling dogs? Modern day German Shepherds being a particular example! Yeah this was one aspect, it was also the discussion around inbreeding to maintain the "Breed Standard" and genetic defects that are introduced as a result. Worth a watch if you have even the remotist liking for dogs though Michael. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grahamc Posted August 26, 2008 Share Posted August 26, 2008 It is sick tbh but we sadly live in a world full of double standards and gov'ts/people interested in making money over anything else. Well said... its all about the money, disgusting! Yeah I saw it and was outraged. Particularly with the Rhodesian Ridgeback club. I can't believe that the distinctive ridge is actually a form of spina bifida (sp?) and that the club are selectively breeding to maintain it. Any dogs born without the ridge should be "culled" (the words of the kennel club). To make matters worse it seems there is a genetic defect in Rhodesians which doesn't appear in the ridgeless dogs, whereby there is an open channel from the skin surface all the way to the dogs spine which can lead to some nasty infections. Then the whole issue of mother-son, father-daughter, brother-sister breeding. None of the pedigree breeders they interviewed saw this as a problem. Apparently it's "completely different" to incest. How? I have to say I really felt for the King Charles Spaniels plight. I can't believe that a dog with this genetic affliction could win best in breed. The owner's reaction when questioned about it said everything imho. I've completely lost all faith in the Pedigree dog world, and have decided that should I get a dog I'll be looking for a Rhodesian Ridgelessback out of principle. I've always liked Rhodies anyway. Mike A mate of mine had 2 ridegebacks, beautiful animals!! Apparently it would go more wild for me coming to visit than any member of the family, even after long stints away! This whole thing of inbreeding, poor genetics, etc, is why I went for my 2 GSD. Pure GSD, but without papers. Beautiful animals, and the 1 female would do well in the comps if she had papers. She is really tall (towers over most male GSDs), stands well (naturally) and very clever (maybe too clever). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SmigzyTT Posted August 26, 2008 Share Posted August 26, 2008 Appauling behaviour from the breeders IMO, they just do it to win shows rather than to ensure the health of the breed. I have a ridgeback and cant believe that people would cull them just because of the lack of a ridge. Saying that the ones that bayed the lions best back in africa were the ones with the ridges?? absolute horse sh1t. Its a disgrace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garethr Posted August 26, 2008 Share Posted August 26, 2008 Just confirmed all my prejudices about "show dog people". The Cruft's judge who thought the German Shepherds were perfect examples, despite the fact that they were half crippled, and obviously looked completely different from the working strains. The Basset Hound breeder who thought likewise, although the Basset of 60 years ago, when they were closer to the original hunting hounds, had longer legs, shorter ears, less loose skin, and a shorter back. The comparison between the original Dachsund and Bull Terrier and the present-day dogs. And don't get me started on the original f***ed-up breed, the Bulldog...... all that crap from the breeders about why they have the grossly undershot jaw and the loose skin. They could have gone on for days -- Greyhounds which can't run, Fox Terriers with a long narrow jaw which would be too weak to tackle a fox, Corgis with legs too short to ever dodge a kick from a cow, the hardest terrier of them all, the Bedlington, crossed with poodles to create a cute fluffy coat, Bearded Collies with such heavy coats that they wouldn't last a day on a snowy Scottish hill..... the list of breeds screwed up by dog showing is never-ending. If I was involved with breeding something like, say, the Plummer Terrier, the last thing I'd want would be for it to become Kennel Club registered, it's the kiss of death. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supragal Posted August 26, 2008 Author Share Posted August 26, 2008 In fairness I think a lot of breeders don't cull ridgeless ones, just make sure they are neutered. I know a few dogs without. The dermoid sinus is only associated with the ridge and any that are born with that are culled, but as a small mercy at least it is evident from birth, it's not something they develop later. Still the worst thing about the breed though. That said so many breeders are total t*ssers about stuff like this. The inbreeding is just insane! Loads of people asked me if I was going to show Stig, no way, it's all about who you know and sod all to do with the dog once you're in that ring anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndrewOW Posted August 26, 2008 Share Posted August 26, 2008 Loads of people asked me if I was going to show Stig, no way, it's all about who you know and sod all to do with the dog once you're in that ring anyway. And Stig's far too good for the likes of them anyway! Hope you're feeling better today Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garethr Posted August 26, 2008 Share Posted August 26, 2008 The inbreeding is just insane!The trouble is almost every breed of domestic animal, as we see it today, is the result of inbreeding and ruthless culling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supragal Posted August 26, 2008 Author Share Posted August 26, 2008 And Stig's far too good for the likes of them anyway! Hope you're feeling better today Thanks I'm feeling worse actually Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supragal Posted August 26, 2008 Author Share Posted August 26, 2008 The trouble is almost every breed of domestic animal, as we see it today, is the result of inbreeding and ruthless culling. Yes exactly. There is very little consumers can do but maybe it will highlight the issue enough to start some kind of change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garethr Posted August 26, 2008 Share Posted August 26, 2008 The trouble is almost every breed of domestic animal, as we see it today, is the result of inbreeding and ruthless culling. Yes exactly. There is very little consumers can do but maybe it will highlight the issue enough to start some kind of change. Except that without the inbreeding and ruthless culling, the breed would not exist in the first place. The problem is that the breeds which resulted do not now have a purpose. For example, there are three types of Greyhound: -- coursing strains -- racing strains -- the show dogs The first two are bred for the way they do their job, the third is bred to meet some artificial "standard". The greyhound is a running dog. Put an example of each strain in a race, and which would finish last? Yet the show breeders would insist that their contender was the near-perfect example of a greyhound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supragal Posted August 26, 2008 Author Share Posted August 26, 2008 But that is because they are basing it on the breed standard, if that was right then it would be ok. Kennel Club need to buck up their ideas. I remember when I got Stig thinking about how totally open and free people were to do basically what they liked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorin Posted August 26, 2008 Share Posted August 26, 2008 Kennel Club need to buck up their ideas. Absolutely, that's where a lot if not most of the blame lies IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garethr Posted August 27, 2008 Share Posted August 27, 2008 The Pedigree Dogs Exposed programme has been posted on YouTube in six parts. If you want to be appalled, watch the start of part 4, particularly the Pug breeder at 2m 20s. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QDKwbWA5Tdg&feature=user EDIT: They have been removed and reposted, I think. Search YouTube for Pedigree Dogs Exposed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorin Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 Kennel Club object to BBC making them look bad, taking bat and ball in (reconsidering giving BBC rights to broadcast Crufts). http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7620507.stm Dogs Trust and RSPCA have withdrawn from their involvement in Crufts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyT Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 RSPCA have pulled all support for Crufts. Yesterdays Daily Mail I think. So the word's out and the Kennel Club will be next. Top. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndrewOW Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 Excellent news. I can't really see how anyone can justify that a 'mutant' can be awarded a prize, when the natural animal is perfection anyway. IMO, of course Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 Kennel Club spokeswoman Caroline Kisko told the BBC it was not "a tenable position" for the broadcaster to show Crufts - a programme "celebrating dogs" - when it had also aired a documentary "which was clearly so heavily biased against dogs". Was she watching the same programme? Biased against dogs? The breeders more like. Given the thread about Sharia law which is now more about religion in general...religion or evolution, either way, who are they to mess about with the look and health of these animals? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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