Wez Posted May 30, 2008 Share Posted May 30, 2008 Still comes through on an email;) bugger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan.G Posted May 30, 2008 Share Posted May 30, 2008 (edited) Most of that you have or can have on a Motec, but it will cost more I expect. Faster processor, oscilloscope and ethernet connection is pretty much irrelevant I would have thought. Knock control would be good. Motec have wideband control but it's a cost option (most people have a controller anyway I guess in any case). Input wise, again you could have all those on a Motec but you'd run out of inputs if you wanted them all, it's got 10 inputs in total IIRC. You can get an add on I/O module to add a bunch more but it's not cheap. Sounds interesting though. I'd be more interested in its reliability, build quality, software and support from mappers and the manufacturer than if it's got an ethernet connection. Are you Joking Simon? Ethernet is one of the fastest methods of connection and with the correct protocol can be used for wireless communication. Faster processor do i even need to explain why this is better. And an built in oscilloscope is fantastic when problem solving any digital inputs like speed signals or Crank signals. I understand Mate that you have a motec and that yes it is a very reliable unit but i just feel for the money now there are better units out there which tbh are actually better. Ryan Edited May 30, 2008 by Ryan.G (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan.G Posted May 30, 2008 Share Posted May 30, 2008 (edited) Sounds interesting though. I'd be more interested in its reliability, build quality, software and support from mappers and the manufacturer than if it's got an ethernet connection. Has anyone got a link to decent info on Life ecu's? A respected colleague spoke highly of them some time ago, but he's in some Godforsaken hole at the moment an incommunicado. Thanks. Funny you should say that Chris as the ecu im talking about is actually a developement of the Life Racing ecu made specifically for the company which i cant name at the moment. They have made the ecu for the company and will not sell it any other way as life ecu are normally made for the race and leman series And as its made by Life i would say that the reliability, build quality, software and support from mappers is very good Ryan Edited May 30, 2008 by Ryan.G (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bolarbag Posted May 30, 2008 Share Posted May 30, 2008 And an built in oscilloscope is fantastic when problem solving any digital inputs like speed signals or Crank signals. I like this feature, and the features do sound very good, at the end of the day all ecu's are the same - especially generic ones that have race experience behind them - if they were all reliable then the customer would have so much choice, this ECU does sound good, with a lot of features that the motec doesnt have I'm not going to change(again) but once this is out I expect people will have another problem of choice on their hands, but at what price? The motec is ridiculously expensive I'm 2300 in so far and thats not incl wiring which I got for free, plus mapping, I'm investing a few different sensors so expect it to be just over £3K I'd be more inclined to buy a standalone ecu these days with a custom wiring harness so that I can take my investment and put it into another car, i see this as a benefit of the motec rather than a plug n play pitfall, I expect this ecu to be the same? There are ways to connect to the motec wirelessly, there is a writeup over on a mkiii forum, pretty impressive but if this has ethernet your laughing One problem i have seen with processor speeds is the refresh rate, the refresh rate on the Motec ADL is shocking, I cant see why people would invest in something that slow, if it was ethernet and a faster processor it would be a powerful nice to have Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan.G Posted May 30, 2008 Share Posted May 30, 2008 I'm not going to change(again) but once this is out I expect people will have another problem of choice on their hands, but at what price? The motec is ridiculously expensive I'm 2300 in so far and thats not incl wiring which I got for free, plus mapping, I'm investing a few different sensors so expect it to be just over £3K I'd be more inclined to buy a standalone ecu these days with a custom wiring harness so that I can take my investment and put it into another car, i see this as a benefit of the motec rather than a plug n play pitfall, I expect this ecu to be the same? Cant release any figures but i can confidently say you could half the costs you will have spent in total. The ecu comes with a connector and pins for making a harness but if the demand is good enough for them on a particular car then a plug in board will be made. Ryan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Wilson Posted May 30, 2008 Share Posted May 30, 2008 Funny you should say that Chris as the ecu im talking about is actually a developement of the Life Racing ecu made specifically for the company which i cant name at the moment. They have made the ecu for the company and will not sell it any other way as life ecu are normally made for the race and leman series And as its made by Life i would say that the reliability, build quality, software and support from mappers is very good Ryan Interesting stuff, please keep us posted. Any likelihood of R33 GTR plug and play looms or boards? Cheers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan.G Posted May 30, 2008 Share Posted May 30, 2008 Interesting stuff, please keep us posted. Any likelihood of R33 GTR plug and play looms or boards? Cheers. Will Pm you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dangerous brain Posted May 30, 2008 Share Posted May 30, 2008 I really struggled with the .68 on the 4088R - like it was breathing through a straw, egts were high too, and response was poor. I might get it with 2 housings to play. My 4088R housings will not fit as the cartridge will be larger I'm guessing... Interesting enough the housings from my T04R fit my BL T67 perfectly (good job really as both the compressor housing and exhaust housing were wrong on the one I bought) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bolarbag Posted May 30, 2008 Share Posted May 30, 2008 That would be a nice to have for anyone who owned a T67 - a HKS Compressor Housing, probably increase resale value too among the uneducated;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dangerous brain Posted May 30, 2008 Share Posted May 30, 2008 Yeah. My compressor housing came with a 90 degree elbow on it and I needed a straight one and the exhaust housing was V-band clamp when mine is 4 bolt up affair doh!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimonB Posted May 30, 2008 Share Posted May 30, 2008 Are you Joking Simon? Ethernet is one of the fastest methods of connection and with the correct protocol can be used for wireless communication. Faster processor do i even need to explain why this is better. And an built in oscilloscope is fantastic when problem solving any digital inputs like speed signals or Crank signals. I understand Mate that you have a motec and that yes it is a very reliable unit but i just feel for the money now there are better units out there which tbh are actually better. Ryan Yes, I'm a software engineer, I'm aware of ethernet speed, but the point is why do you need that speed? Does it matter what speed the software connects to the ECU at? Any connection is faster than your eye and brain's ability to do anything with the info. I'm not a mapper, so maybe you're right and you would benefit from a faster connection, but it's not obvious to me! Of course wireless might be nice - not that easy to rig up in a car I would have thought though. Same goes for a faster processor. As long as it's fast enough to control things properly it doesn't need to be any faster. I don't need a new ECU, but if I was in the market for one I don't think I'd be interested in those features particularly, that's the point I'm trying to make. Cost on the other hand... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan.G Posted May 30, 2008 Share Posted May 30, 2008 Yes, I'm a software engineer, I'm aware of ethernet speed, but the point is why do you need that speed? Does it matter what speed the software connects to the ECU at? Any connection is faster than your eye and brain's ability to do anything with the info. I'm not a mapper, so maybe you're right and you would benefit from a faster connection, but it's not obvious to me! Of course wireless might be nice - not that easy to rig up in a car I would have thought though. Same goes for a faster processor. As long as it's fast enough to control things properly it doesn't need to be any faster. I don't need a new ECU, but if I was in the market for one I don't think I'd be interested in those features particularly, that's the point I'm trying to make. Cost on the other hand... The faster connection is only going to noticable when mapping and it is very notiable. When making big block changes, Motec and other ecu's take a while to update. This is instant Ryan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike B Posted May 31, 2008 Author Share Posted May 31, 2008 Still no further forward in choosing a new tubby, it's a bit of a minefield... I had this info back from a chap that deals in all the makes I'm looking at, "Despite your failure, I will stand behind a Garrett turbo any day. Them and Borg make the finest parts on the market. Doesn’t mean one can’t fail of course. HKS are Garrett turbos as well, just in case you did not know. BL are made by Precision. Precision is the bang-for-buck turbo in the USA." The prices I am getting for TO4Z are high, like £1200 quid plus. BL is half that.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nic Posted May 31, 2008 Share Posted May 31, 2008 (edited) The prices I am getting for TO4Z are high, like £1200 quid plus. BL is half that.... Mike, I should be able to get a Garrett T-04Z a fair bit cheaper than that, let me know what spec you're wanting and I'll price up. Edited May 31, 2008 by Nic (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike B Posted May 31, 2008 Author Share Posted May 31, 2008 pm sent Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-Ricky Posted June 19, 2008 Share Posted June 19, 2008 (edited) Just dragging this up again to make an interesting point, after speaking at length to a couple of well know turbo specialists last week, i thought i would run the the problems people have had with the GT4088 past them, and one did some checking with Garrett and came back with this, the catridge and turbines are exactly the same for the petrol and diesel versions, its the exhaust housing that is made from a slightly different material, the guy surmised that the problem may lie with the housing distorting due to heat and screwing the turbine, but when i pointed out that the blades that had failed where very jagged, he was then a little perplexed, as in theory the damage should be uniform if it down to the housing, but i am wondering if the turbine material is possible for the blades to shatter at the ends rather than wear. Edited June 19, 2008 by Tricky-Ricky (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Wilson Posted June 19, 2008 Share Posted June 19, 2008 Are these genuine Garrett cartridges? What's the part number on them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-Ricky Posted June 19, 2008 Share Posted June 19, 2008 Obviously its going to be difficult to check for those that had problems as they may have binned them, but surly if they where suppled by reputable traders they would be all Garrett, as this applies to both the plain and BB type. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike B Posted June 19, 2008 Author Share Posted June 19, 2008 I will get all the cartridge info tonight on my 4088R, it's stripped down in the garage. it's odd... the T67DBB is supposed to be a larger turbo than the 4088R... right? the T67 turbine has more blades, but is a smaller diameter, (blades are much thicker though) and the T67 compressor is slightly larger on the cold side. The AR of the turbine housing looks different to the garrett units as well. black art! I can't find any info on the net about turbine shapes and designs.... I guess there is a ig difference between styles.. but what it is... As far as dissipating heat goes the blades of the T67 Turbine are much thicker and so will be far more durable. My 4088R are more then chipped, they are visibaly bent over where they have melted/impacted as the turbine came apart. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Posted June 19, 2008 Share Posted June 19, 2008 T67 = 67mm compressor side GT4088R somewhere in the 65mm range in the same place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jevansio Posted June 19, 2008 Share Posted June 19, 2008 I will get all the cartridge info tonight on my 4088R, it's stripped down in the garage. it's odd... the T67DBB is supposed to be a larger turbo than the 4088R... right? the T67 turbine has more blades, but is a smaller diameter, (blades are much thicker though) and the T67 compressor is slightly larger on the cold side. The AR of the turbine housing looks different to the garrett units as well. black art! I can't find any info on the net about turbine shapes and designs.... I guess there is a ig difference between styles.. but what it is... As far as dissipating heat goes the blades of the T67 Turbine are much thicker and so will be far more durable. My 4088R are more then chipped, they are visibaly bent over where they have melted/impacted as the turbine came apart. Looking forward to your thoughts on the T67 Mike, would like to know if it packs any more top end punch than the GT4088R Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike B Posted June 19, 2008 Author Share Posted June 19, 2008 Will do bud.... I have heard good things... I have other problems now though... see other thread! nice pic btw. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike B Posted June 20, 2008 Author Share Posted June 20, 2008 Here is the pic of the tubby serial no if anyone fancies doing some detective work. Would be good to put the diesel/petrol 4088R myth to bed. If they are selling us diesel turbos we should hold it against Garrett forever! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wez Posted June 20, 2008 Share Posted June 20, 2008 From this catalog http://www.turbobygarrett.com/turbobygarrett/images/catalog/catalog_common/Garrett2007Catalog.pdf :- GT4088R 751470-1 751450-9 Ball Oil & Water 63.5mm 88.0mm 52 0.72 77.0mm 78 0.85 Free Float 400 - 700 2.0L - 6.0L GT4088R 751470-2 751450-9 Ball Oil & Water 63.5mm 88.0mm 52 0.72 77.0mm 78 0.95 Free Float 400 - 700 2.0L - 6.0L GT4088R 751470-3 751450-9 Ball Oil & Water 63.5mm 88.0mm 52 0.72 77.0mm 78 1.06 Free Float 400 - 700 2.0L - 6.0L GT4088R 751470-4 751450-9 Ball Oil & Water 63.5mm 88.0mm 52 0.72 77.0mm 78 1.19 Free Float 400 - 700 2.0L - 6.0L Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike B Posted June 20, 2008 Author Share Posted June 20, 2008 They are the product cose which half match, but the turbine housings are all interchangable anyway. Half the code matches, but it's the upper number I expect to be the cartridge ID. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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