Smoke and Oil

[Phil the fixer]

Ill start by saying this is not a thread seeking to make trouble for any individual or company, I’m just very concerned about the potential effect of what happened to my supe.

NOW THE STORY

I collected the supe yesterday after it had MOT and service, it seemed to be smoking a little as I drove away on the minor roads (I thought this might be due to over filling of engine oil), the trouble really started when I got onto the Motorway, foot ever so slightly down officer and I lost all sight behind – not things getting very small like usual but smoke covering everything behind, so foot straight off and smoke gets less – I pull over to the slow lane, not so much smoke now and continue to next exit – try the foot down trick again and same happens, you know the feeling – OH SH1T, SH1T, SH1T, SH1T, I nurse her to the next filling station, no oil light showing at this stage, stop and give the fast peddle a flick or two, just a little smoke but no great clouds like on the motorway, up the bonnet and check the oil and ………..fukc me no oil showing on the dip stick, so into the shop and look for their very best synth oil which wasn’t my usual Mobile 1 so put a couple of litres in which now shows on the dip stick, I didn’t want to top it up cos I didn’t fully know what quality I was putting in – so I pull out of the filling station and nurse my baby along the minor roads and again there’s just a small trace of smoke behind and no oil light on, now I’ve got to go on another motorway, so I nurse her ones again in the slow lane and then the oil light start going on then off and by the time I get to the next exit it pretty much on all the time except when going around the roundabout when what’s left of the oil is moving about, I find the next petrol station and more oil as before, well this goes on until I get home – 6L of crap oil and 4L Mobile 1 later, I spoke the chappy who did the service and we chewed it all over (the car has only covered 32,000, no sign of smoke before, has not burnt oil before, previously service by Dude – who incidentally did not do this particular service and can confirm how bleeding fussy I am about using the best lubes etc etc etc) the only thing we could think of was that the oil filter had not sealed and oil was escaping so we agreed that I top her up with Mobile 1 and parked her up for the night and give the engine a run for about half an hour in the morning and see what happens – this morning I didn’t need to start her up a bleeding great big pool of oil under my baby – yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes a great weight lifted off my head cos its not something in the engine or mechanical stuff, I phoned the chappy again this morning and we agreed I get the AA out to confirm what’s up so he can put it right.

My only worry as I sit here thinking is DID WHAT HAPPENED DO ANY DAMAGE OTHER THAN MAKE THE UNDERSIDE AND LOWER PART OF THE ENGINE LOOK LIKE AN ARABIAN OIL FIELD. COME BACK SUPRA BUDDIES.

 

Cheers

 

Phil

[Guest Sakura]

I can't help with your question because I'm not a techie - just wanted to empathise because I know how I would feel if it was me.

 

I hope everything is OK

[matt]

So where is the oil leaking from??

 

Damaged?? depends if you're talking about the low level warning light or the low pressure warning light coming on...

 

FWIW , when I blew a crankseal at rockingham it would pour oil out at anything above 2k revs.

I limped home at sub 2k revs stopping every 20 miles to top up the oil when the low level light came on.

The car was fine after I replaced seal ...

 

however the low oil pressure light never came on.

 

If you've done the same , you'll probably be fine.

If the low pressure light even flickered..... I'd be getting the sump off (at the garages expense) for a looksee

[dangerous brain]

"It shouldn't" have done any irreversible damage if the only light you got was the low oil level warning (ie the yellow one). If however you drove it for any length of time with a red low oil pressure warning light on then perhaps things may not be too rosy.

 

In effect what you would do running it with low oil pressure is radically increase the wear rate across the engine in all oil lubricated areas. The longer you run it with low oil pressure and the higher the RPM and hence temperatures involved the more the wear rate will accelerate. More heat is produced in the friction areas and is dissapated less by the lower oil pressure etc so it can get a bit exponential.

 

I shouldn't panic at this stage and think OMG my engines knackered. The sort of damage done if you kept the revs down and managed to keep the time in the red down should be limited to just scrubbing a few thousand miles worth of life off the engine.

[Phil the fixer]

Update

AA man says it doesn't look like its a loose filter cos that dry, he also said it doesn't look like the drain plug though he couldn't be sure, he says it looks like it coming from the front underside of the engine but cant see because of the engine under cover and the amount of oil that's all over the place. So he says sorry there's nothing the AA can do at the roadside to sort the situation, so I said can they relay the supe to the chappy who serviced it - no he says, because I've made it back home (eg less than .25 of a mile from my home) they will only take it to a repairer of their choice unless I can nominate one closer. Anyway the AA man says you will need a special truck to pick this up with (it being quite low) and the AA don't have trucks like that. Now I'm quite a cool sort but I'm starting to feel just the beginnings of being pi55ed off, I then spoke with the chappy who serviced my supe who said try the AA again, I phone the AA and guess what .......there's nothing they can do except take it to a garage of there choice etc, etc, etc.

To cool down a bit I went and washed the supe to cleaned the back end of the 5h1ty oil coating gracing the lovely paintwork.

Well after that phoned the chappy again and left a message with the excellent news.

Update to follow

Sakura - thanks for the kind thoughts m8.

matt - AA man couldn't see were it was leaking, it was the yellow low level warning light that was on.

DB - No red light so hopefully no damage, thanks for the reassurance.

 

Cheers

 

Phil

[Guest Sakura]

I think it's time to get tough with the garage that did the service - it's easy for them to keep directing you towards the AA, hoping that the AA will transport your car.

 

Tell them it was fine before they "serviced" it, and you want them to collect the car NOW and sort it out.

 

I know of someone who can transport very low cars, he was an absolute diamond when I had to arrange to get a Soop with a very low front moved to a garage. If you PM me, I can give you his name and mobile number. You can get a price from him, and tell the garage they will have to pay.

[Jake]

So if it's not the oil filter or drain plug where can the oil be coming from? Front crank seal maybe?

[dangerous brain]

Is the level going down statically? ie with the engine switched off. This is only really ascertainable by checking the dipstick, possibly marking it with an indelible pen and checking it again in 24 hours. Oil will if its on the drip pan under the engine continue to splat on down for quite a while and make it appear to be leaking statically.

 

If its a dynamic leak isn't that area you described ie front bottom of engine where the crankseal is that lets go?? Dude or one of the techs will know that of course.

[Phil the fixer]

Sakura - I'm waiting for the chappy to get back to me with what to do next now the AA can do no more, I hope he comes back with a good positive action to resolve the situation, yes the engine bay didn't have a drip of oil in it before the service. Ill certainly pm you after Ive heard from the chappy.

Jake - Exactly my question, made even more of a puzzle as Dude replaced the crank seal last year without a sign of oil since. By the way m8 was that you in Chandlers Ford the other day.

DB - I think it seems to be a dynamic leak, at first a load of oil collected under the car and then it slowed and seems to have stopped, I dont think it can be the crank seal as that was replaced and Ive only done a max of about 1k miles since with no show of oil.

Thanks for the replies buddies

 

Cheers

 

Phil

[Terminator]

Hmm car fine before MOT and service. After service car now smoke machine and drive way oil slick maker. Sounds like a garage to be avoided to me. Sorry that is no help but somethings up and it points to them.

 

If it were my car I would not want anyone connect with that garage to touch it until I could find what was wrong. I would suggest taking off the under tray and degreasing the oiled parts and jet washing it down. Top up with oil and see if you can spot a static leak. If not run it up whilst under the car.

 

One of my other cars had a big oil leak and I could not find where it was coming from until I did the above including under tray removal, turned out to be a cam chain access cover seal mid way down the engine, impossible to see from above or below with oil all over the place. It took about 20 seconds to spot once the engine was clean and running. I know I am talking about a totally different engine but the principle is the same.

 

I would not rule out the crank oil seal premature failure is not unheard of.

 

I wonder if the muppets damage the sump with a stand or something, it has happened before.

 

BTW what did they say they had done in the service????

 

Good luck Phil

[Jake]

Originally posted by Phil the fixer

Jake -By the way m8 was that you in Chandlers Ford the other day.

Yeah it was. I did wave but didn't think you noticed us. Your motor is fine looking.

[Phil the fixer]

Phil - Hi m8, yep certainly was fine bofore, only got it serviced because Im slightly excessive about these things only done about 1k miles since last service. As anyone who saw my engine bay at Santa Pod knows it was all very clean and dry.

I will probably do as you suggest and whip the under cover off and have a clean and see what I can see, only prob is Im away for a few days so it wont be until next week.

As for crank oil seal premature failure - always a possibility but strange on the day I pick it up from a service.

The service included - Fuel filter, Drain plug, Oil filter, Vent hoses, Engine oil, screen wash.

 

Jake - only caught you at the last moment I was chatting with my son, gave a wave but it must have been to late, your supe is looking fine too and I do like those wheels.

 

Cheers

 

Phil

[matt]

Sounds like the front seal could be the issue.

They usually go after a real caning.........

 

 

Got a boost controller?

[Phil the fixer]

matt - wish I had chance to give it a bit of a caning but just the acceleration run from the slip road onto the motorway showed the problem:( , so no big grin that day.

Got a boost controller, no, and as I understand it, they are mainly used for raising boost levels and are limited in there capability of reducing boost levels, Ive got a boost gauge which hasnt been above 1.1 even with Dude at the wheel.

 

Cheers

 

Phil

[Ian C]

I can't think of anything that the mechanic would have intefered with that would cause such a dramatic oil leak apart from the filter and the sump plug. The sump plug would just piss the oil out until it was empty, but not really get it all over the engine bay, apart from towards the rear due to slipstream. The filter sounds like the culprit but you say it's clean? It could be leaking out under pressure but in such a way the oil never actually makes it onto the filter itself, it just sprays out.

 

I guess it wasn't an overfilling issue as the oil would only vent until it got down to normal levels.

 

I imagine the smoke was caused by oil getting on the exhaust? Large amounts can cause a fire so be careful

 

-Ian

[Scooter]

Could be a (catastrophic) failure of the Oil pressure sensor.

 

Mine went but is was more of a gradual thing, yellow light eventually came on but no smoke plumes only a little noticed when i pulled into a garage one time.

 

Mechanic guy i know diagnosed it, by having it on ramps and starting it. The oil was being pumped out when running.

 

If it is this then oil more likely to be concentrated on the passenger side on of the block (below the oil filter location) mine was bone dry looking from above.

[dude]

Have you sorted anything since our conversation Phil ???, what filter did they put on , was it the Lexus one ending 2004???, if you really do get stuck i can come down and have a looksee but this is really down to the garage who did the service !!!!to do , failing that any Kwik Fit type garage with a ramp should be able to whip off the tray and have a look , which vent hoses did they change ??????

 

Dude:flame Dev

[Terminator]

Phil make sure the garage are aware that the problem exits and it started within X miles of leaving their premises. You will bring the car back at your convenience. It really is their problem. (you probably have done this but I have not got time to back through the thread.).

The reason I would want to look, is to be sure of the reason, component failure unless caused by their negligence is just bad luck, anything else is down to sloppy work man ship.

 

I had some warranty work done on another car the other week, water pump change. Started to loose a little water, but due to wet weather could see any signs underneath. topped it up for a few days. First dry opportunity I went underneath and found the main hose at the bottom of the pump with the clip just push back on the hose not tightened up. It needed quite a few turns to get it tight. Good job we had not thrashed the car of the hose might have blown off with interesting consequences.