MKIVDreamer Posted November 8, 2005 Share Posted November 8, 2005 Interesting question. I would suppose that it's not such a clear cut case of manual vs auto round a track, but more what provides the best, most responsive means of controlling the engine and shifting gears. From my limited knowledge it seems like most performance cars/rally cars are very much moving towards a hybrid of manual and auto - presumably to try and get the the best of both worlds...? just my 0.5p Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyefi Posted November 8, 2005 Share Posted November 8, 2005 haaahahaa. i can't believe anyone still posts in these threads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Posted November 8, 2005 Share Posted November 8, 2005 The auto is faster in the average man's hands, day to day. Easily repeatable fast times. The manual has the outright "record" though, but is much more tricky to get it right. I've owned two manual's and ran my old BPU against Soop's old auto car from about 40-100ish of a round about. Both cars were neck and neck...bar the shifting...he got a car length on me everytime I shifted...and my shifts don't last that long...I'd gain in between shifts though - a little. (Both cars were BPU.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chilli Posted November 8, 2005 Share Posted November 8, 2005 Just as a slight aside, I wonder, does the manual work better as a JDM spec car? Since when shifting if your lifting the throttle and so turbo lag could be an issue? I don't believe I loose any speed when changing, except maybe that tricky 4th to 5th change lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Posted November 8, 2005 Share Posted November 8, 2005 Just as a slight aside, I wonder, does the manual work better as a JDM spec car? Since when shifting if your lifting the throttle and so turbo lag could be an issue? I don't believe I loose any speed when changing, except maybe that tricky 4th to 5th change lol. Hardly when you're shifting at 7000rpm....even a big single is hits instanto full boost when gunning it. Assuming the boost threshold is around 4000rpm. On a manual you won't drop below 4000 when going for it. It's not that you lose speed it's that you don't carry on accelerating - Auto's have less gear changes so pause accelerating for less time...and their gear change is significantly swifter and not prone to botching. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chilli Posted November 8, 2005 Share Posted November 8, 2005 fair point, I had thought lifting the throttle would dump the boost causing the turbos to have to spool again? I guess RLTC with full throttle shifting and no botch changes could see an improvement Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Terry S Posted November 8, 2005 Share Posted November 8, 2005 Can you beat my sub 5 second 0-60 ? (See Sig) Yep Seriously, I love the manual to bits but if your sole purpose was getting down the 1/4 an auto is faster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest zish Posted November 8, 2005 Share Posted November 8, 2005 Ha ha, I didn't expect to see so many posts on this. My original question was due to a little disagreement with my brother. He drives a S2000 and has been on at me constantly since I told him i'm getting an auto soop. He has been using the good old 'but it handles like a barge' comments and i've been using the 'superior straight line speed' reply. All very immature and Anyway, he went and found those stats and now claims his car is better round the twisties and just as fast in a straight line I told him we'll see when I get the car, but i can rest safe in the knowledge that my car will be better looking and more suitable to london driving with the auto box. Horses for courses really. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeyb10supra Posted November 8, 2005 Share Posted November 8, 2005 you'll kill him mate in all areas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suprasteve Posted November 8, 2005 Share Posted November 8, 2005 you'll kill him mate in all areas in both an auto or manual wayhey we agree on something ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chilli Posted November 8, 2005 Share Posted November 8, 2005 seconded lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnA Posted November 8, 2005 Share Posted November 8, 2005 He's dead meat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Harwood Posted November 8, 2005 Share Posted November 8, 2005 Sorry to keep this one going, but I just want to explain my opinion. so it's slower after 100? lol Yes, IMHO, that's when the manual IS quicker. With the forces of wind resistance at very high speeds, the manual has the advantage of using slightly higher ratios, (or lower, depending on your point of view ) And potentially less power loss at this critical point. problem is it's never possible to evaluate identical cars, unless you could test one and then do a transmission change on it and test again with everything else identical. I did exactly that. When I bought the manual car, I took off all the mods I'd put on the auto, and put them onto the manual car. So in theory, they were about as identical as they could have been. With the auto on the drag strip, I was consistantly in the high 12's/low 13's. With the manual, (same mods), I was far more eratic, (with bad launches, and bad gearchanges), but when I did get it right, I could never manage to get into the 12's Lets face it, a dragstrip has to be the ultimate measure of acceleration... I appreciate that you've got good knowledge of both though, so what made you pick a manual in the end then? Simple, because the manual box can handle a lot more power without the expense of having to uprate the autobox or the need for a high-stall. And, IMO it's more fun. It isn't, however, as nice to drive on a daily basis as the auto was..... And by the way, Zish, you should have no problem against a pretty little S2000. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnA Posted November 8, 2005 Share Posted November 8, 2005 Furthermore, efficiency-wise, I wouldn't think that anybody here would disagree that the autobox saps more power. It's the nature of the beast... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chilli Posted November 8, 2005 Share Posted November 8, 2005 With the manual, (same mods), I was far more eratic, (with bad launches, and bad gearchanges), but when I did get it right, I could never manage to get into the 12's Lets face it, a dragstrip has to be the ultimate measure of acceleration... Do you think the majority of that time was lost at the launch? were you using RLTC or similar? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Harwood Posted November 8, 2005 Share Posted November 8, 2005 Possibly. I've tried with RLTC on, on at various degrees of slip, launch control set at various RPM points, and completely off. Launch with very limited slip and warm drag radials seems to work best, but I still need lots of practice Also possibly due to having to do one possibly two more gearchanges than the auto needs to do. If you can cross the line at 130+ (Not that I've done that yet), the auto still only needs to do two gearchanges. The manual needs to do 4!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imi Posted November 9, 2005 Share Posted November 9, 2005 I think that if you're a very very very good driver (ie not me!) you'll be able to get the manual to 60 quicker than an auto.... but for most ordinary drivers the automatic's fool-proof gear changes will be more consistently quick So what you are saying is that the MAN is quicker to 60 than the Auto Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chilli Posted November 9, 2005 Share Posted November 9, 2005 lol the car maybe is overall, seems like not many drivers can get the most out of it, myself included no doubt. It does seem that the majority of owners on here are interested in the 1/4 mile / traffic light gran prix thing, which is cool but I wonder if this is why the auto is favoured so much. When you compare to other similar motors, take the skyline for example, from what I've seen the manual is the car of choice, maybe these guys are more into the drivability and all round (road and track) performance, not just going quick in a straight line from a stand still... who knows, plenty of different opinions on here, enough to make no entirely clear winner for everyone, so as long as each of us is happy with our choice then who can complain at the end of the day Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scoboblio Posted November 9, 2005 Share Posted November 9, 2005 as long as each of us is happy with our choice then who can complain at the end of the day So what you are saying is that the MAN is quicker to 60 than the Auto Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Terry S Posted November 9, 2005 Share Posted November 9, 2005 Possibly. I've tried with RLTC on, on at various degrees of slip, launch control set at various RPM points, and completely off. Launch with very limited slip and warm drag radials seems to work best, but I still need lots of practice Also possibly due to having to do one possibly two more gearchanges than the auto needs to do. If you can cross the line at 130+ (Not that I've done that yet), the auto still only needs to do two gearchanges. The manual needs to do 4!!! And remember you launch like a girl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chilli Posted November 9, 2005 Share Posted November 9, 2005 lol that makes two of us then! My clutch is like a light switch, slipping it it like trying to dim the lights by holding the switch between off and on heh, ok once it's moving though. It's good for a flat out launch, I'd always be worried of braking something though, I guess these cars are pretty strong though transmission wise! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Terry S Posted November 9, 2005 Share Posted November 9, 2005 with the drag radials on you can rev to 5k and side step the clutch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chilli Posted November 9, 2005 Share Posted November 9, 2005 ouch I bet you don't spend long in 1st gear then, or 2nd. I'll have to come along to an event and see for myself sometime Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Terry S Posted November 9, 2005 Share Posted November 9, 2005 Dont do many 1/4's mate TBH, but the technique seems to works ok. Got a 1.8 second 60' at TOTB this year, just a shame I was hitting boost cut all the way down the track! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imi Posted November 9, 2005 Share Posted November 9, 2005 Originally Posted by imi So what you are saying is that the MAN is quicker to 60 than the Auto Accept it and get on with your life...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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