shifted Posted November 18, 2012 Author Share Posted November 18, 2012 That don't sound right Mine does nothing like that That is why I was thinking it has to be on that side of the motor. I don't think replacing the intake manifold with go around the issue either? Has it got a fuel cut eliminator? If so remove it an see what happens. Not that I am aware of, car is stock. All it had in it was a Starbo Adaptor (for turbo timer it seems) and that is all I am aware of, I had it removed. Car drive fine almost a year before all this happened. very similar or should I say exact same issue that I had in my r33 gtr. No fault codes etc were showing and everything sugguested that the afms were fine. We replaced them anyway and now the issue is gone so dont just reply on a bit of tech telling whats wrong. Sadly the gtr has found a new owner though I was thinking AFM initially also but when driving - AFM is cold, right? So at 70km/hr it shouldn't be overheating/malfunctioning or anything?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonR24 Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 I had the same symptoms on my astra coupe turbo and it came back as the ecu but was actually the crank sensor.... So beats me but that might be worth a clean/change over? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wile e coyote Posted November 18, 2012 Share Posted November 18, 2012 Any news on this mate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shifted Posted November 19, 2012 Author Share Posted November 19, 2012 Someone has mentioned the Throttle Control ECU however this is the plan (went out on Saturday to buy some more tools)... 1. Remove RHS of throttle body (where the sensors and stuff are) have a look, contact cleaner, see if anything is amiss - very little space though :-/ 2. Get paid (monthly ) 3. If throttle body seems fine - crank angle sensors will be purchased and replaced. Unfortunately it will be some trouble shooting. I had code P1633 come up if I recall correctly, "abnormal ECU" - however seeing my ECU has not being touched and the problem is intermittent, I think this is more of something else failing and shorting something out. Worst case scenario, an aftermarket ECU and intake manifold etc. will need to be purchased which essentially means the big single build comes sooner than expected. However, I'm expecting it to be a simple sensor failure or the like due to age. Other than that, unless I find a VVT-i throttle body to test against it will be difficult I guess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Wilson Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 I've never heard anything like it.... Just find, for example, a Motec installer and ask them to scope the various senders and sensors on the FBW throotle, and read the crank sensor output. Madness, sheer madness just throwing bits at it. ANY competent auto electrician should be able to diagnose a problem like this. Jeez, even I could, and I am no electronics genius. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wile e coyote Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 As chris has said Just get an auto electrician to diagnose the fault, it will save you money in the long run Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shifted Posted November 19, 2012 Author Share Posted November 19, 2012 I've never heard anything like it.... Just find, for example, a Motec installer and ask them to scope the various senders and sensors on the FBW throotle, and read the crank sensor output. Madness, sheer madness just throwing bits at it. ANY competent auto electrician should be able to diagnose a problem like this. Jeez, even I could, and I am no electronics genius. So you think best thing is going around it with a multimeter and checking every sensor? I know taking it to a shop will be good but paying $100/hr for someone to do what I could probably have a crack at myself first (may as well learn) can get very expensive... That, and the 2JZ experts here in Perth are a good 45-60 minute drive from me - car dying on a stretch like worries me. I don't mind trouble shooting stuff first - I have a car to use while the Supra is in the garage - least I learn this way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Wilson Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 You NEED an oscilloscope, and the knowledge of how to use it, and read the displays. Nearly every modern car is now fly by wire, the Supra is old hat to a modern technician, so no need AT ALL for a Supra expert, the electronics are basic and simple compared to many modern cars. That's my take, anyway, for what it's worth. Fiddling with a multi meter MAY find the issue, IF you know what to probe and what readings to expect. If you don't know you can easily blow the ECU up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shifted Posted November 20, 2012 Author Share Posted November 20, 2012 Well I guess I'll have to reassess my options lol Will wait to see what cash I have in the bank start of next month when pay comes in, may need a trip down to the 2JZ experts, if I am going to take it to a shop... may as well be the best one over here that deals with Supra and their engines on a daily basis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EMPEROR Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Don't you have a friend with VVTi Supra? Somebody should be kind enough to give you Throttle body and ECU for the test. Did you ask 98SZR on your forums? I have 2 throttle bodies and 2 ecus, but you are damn far away from me... Btw if you take off your throttle body and part it out to clean it, MAKE SURE TO MARK YOUR EXACT TPS POSITION!!!, before you unscrew the bolts... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wile e coyote Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Well I guess I'll have to reassess my options lol Will wait to see what cash I have in the bank start of next month when pay comes in, may need a trip down to the 2JZ experts, if I am going to take it to a shop... may as well be the best one over here that deals with Supra and their engines on a daily basis. Exactly what I would do You could cause more damage Let us know how you get on mate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTJUDGE Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 (edited) That is why I was thinking it has to be on that side of the motor. I don't think replacing the intake manifold with go around the issue either? Not that I am aware of, car is stock. All it had in it was a Starbo Adaptor (for turbo timer it seems) and that is all I am aware of, I had it removed. Car drive fine almost a year before all this happened. I was thinking AFM initially also but when driving - AFM is cold, right? So at 70km/hr it shouldn't be overheating/malfunctioning or anything?? what power are you running? when We checked mine everything seemed ok but for the sake of £120 I replaced them anyway as they were still stock. After replacing them the issue was sorted and the tuner was dumbfounded. Edited November 20, 2012 by JTJUDGE (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shifted Posted November 20, 2012 Author Share Posted November 20, 2012 (edited) Had to pay for some membership so couldn't reply earlier and didn't figure it out til I already sent a PM to wile e coyote (sorry mate!) what power are you running? when We checked mine everything seemed ok but for the sake of £120 I replaced them anyway as they were still stock. After replacing them the issue was sorted and the tuner was dumbfounded. Stock bar exhaust as far as I know. I'm assuming you replaced the Crank Angle Sensors? That's the first thing most shops I have spoken to have said without looking at the car. Don't you have a friend with VVTi Supra? Somebody should be kind enough to give you Throttle body and ECU for the test. Did you ask 98SZR on your forums? I have 2 throttle bodies and 2 ecus, but you are damn far away from me... Btw if you take off your throttle body and part it out to clean it, MAKE SURE TO MARK YOUR EXACT TPS POSITION!!!, before you unscrew the bolts... Not many here, and I'm not really a fan of putting someone out due to my own problem but I think I'll ask to at least test the Igniter and Throttle Control ECU. By any chance, do you have a guide/breakdown of how people maintain their throttle body? I don't want to take things apart blindly. If you could provide any more specific information on this I would greatly appreciate it. Exactly what I would do You could cause more damage Let us know how you get on mate I don't mind tinkering with the car where I know I can't screw something up, at least to attempt it myself first and learn - where something is far too intricate for me or too risky I don't go near it and either ask someone who knows what they are doing or go past a shop. Unfortunately this month I have had a fair bit of time off due to uni exams - hence the greater need of attempting it myself first. Edit: Organising to swap Igniter and Throttle Control ECU sometime hopefully this weekend and test it out. Edited November 20, 2012 by shifted (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Wilson Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 (edited) Fuel pressure gauge on the fuel line, current clamp on an injector wire, to a 2 channel scope, back probe a coil pack switch side and have that on the other scope channel, go for a drive, if the scope will log, set logging. Wait for problem look at pressure gauge, look at scope. See if cranking it still gives an injector and coil signal. Go from there. You could waggle the ecu loom wires about near the main ecu connector and see if that does anything untoward. A decent auto electrician should diagnose this, if it plays up in his time with the car, very easily though, engines that just STOP are the easiest to find the problem with. It's highly unlikely to be the fly by wire, they have fail safe and it should still idle or run with much reduced throttle availability. Makers don't "do" FBW that causes the engine to just STOP. That's me done.... Good luck. Edited November 20, 2012 by Chris Wilson (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ugp Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 ^^ That. It's pointless faffing around changing things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shifted Posted November 20, 2012 Author Share Posted November 20, 2012 Fuel pressure gauge on the fuel line, current clamp on an injector wire, to a 2 channel scope, back probe a coil pack switch side and have that on the other scope channel, go for a drive, if the scope will log, set logging. Wait for problem look at pressure gauge, look at scope. See if cranking it still gives an injector and coil signal. Go from there. You could waggle the ecu loom wires about near the main ecu connector and see if that does anything untoward. A decent auto electrician should diagnose this, if it plays up in his time with the car, very easily though, engines that just STOP are the easiest to find the problem with. It's highly unlikely to be the fly by wire, they have fail safe and it should still idle or run with much reduced throttle availability. Makers don't "do" FBW that causes the engine to just STOP. That's me done.... Good luck. I'll give that a shot if I can attempt it myself comfortably. Like mentioned above, changing igniter and throttle control ecu this weekend hopefully with another vvti owner to see if either are the cause. Will get onto finding a decent auto electrician. My initial thoughts with the throttle body was due to someone else mentioning having a similar problem and by changing it - their problem was solved. Either way, will test some pieces this weekend and see what happens, will update! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shifted Posted November 24, 2012 Author Share Posted November 24, 2012 Swapped igniters with another VVT-i RZ owner... His car - single turbo (low boost), stock ECU, went for a quick lap - no problems (obviously this wouldn't necessarily cause the intermittent stall to occur) Ran his igniter in my car, car happily drove as normal - still, not really ideal as doesn't necessarily let the problem occur.... SO! He has my igniter installed, and his one is with him just in case the problem occurs he can do a quick swap and be on his way without any hassles or dramas. Hopefully he can run it all week and see if anything happens. Even if nothing happens at least we'll know it isn't that part... My thoughts on the igniter (uneducated) - I assumed it sparks and fires when you are starting the car only? after that it doesn't do anything? or is it something that constantly operates? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wile e coyote Posted November 24, 2012 Share Posted November 24, 2012 Keep us posted mate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shifted Posted November 25, 2012 Author Share Posted November 25, 2012 I was looking up japanese products for the VVti and I have come accross this kit that gives you full control of the throttle no matter what ! the throttle ecu is still able to spin its own motor so apparently it doesnt get upset and throw the engine check light on. The idle speed is still able to be controlled by the ecu as when throttle is closed the normal operation by the ecu is resumed and can adjust throttle to keep car idling as per normal as soon as you press throttle control is solely in your hands (foot) here is a youtube vid in japanese showing it working on a 1jz vvti throttle body .first part of video demonstrates how the unmodified throttle works you can see clearly how your input is overridden by ecu you will see from 2:15 the guy shows how the idle speed will work by installing that little peice so the ecu can only operate the butterfly atidle only ! Vehicle Model Supra: 2JZ-GTE: Late Model engine JZA80 Year: After ※ minor change in August 2002 - September 1997 only fit (with VVT-i) the cost to buy it is around $330 around $442 delivered to your door via the many yahoo auction sites Not sure if this could solve my problem, but cheaper than trying to buy a new throttle body if I can't locate one second hand (should that part be the fault when testing). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wile e coyote Posted November 26, 2012 Share Posted November 26, 2012 Interesting that Do you have a link to buy that somewhere in English Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shifted Posted December 2, 2012 Author Share Posted December 2, 2012 (edited) I'll see if I can get the muzzy_tt guy to forward a link. So far, igniter seems to not be the issue (though only tested it for a few days). Dave (off AU forums) wired a bulb into the fuel loom so basically if the car shuts off and the light does too, fuel pump controller needs to be bypassed, if the bulb stays on, change the fuel pump. If it is neither of these things then onto the next bit of testing. It'll take some time, but I enjoy learning, I have a daily so I don't mind keeping the Supra in limited use also (keeps the kms nice and low ). Unfortunately as I cannot force this problem to happen, even if I change parts over then how am I meant to know the problem is solved? LOL Edited December 2, 2012 by shifted (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wile e coyote Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 Any more news on this mate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shifted Posted January 23, 2013 Author Share Posted January 23, 2013 (edited) I've been running a spare fuel loom as above - haven't had the problem show up since so the next step is buying a new replacement fuel loom and changing it over. Edit: IIRC P1633 was the code thrown out months ago, checking the diagnostic manual it points to replacing the ECM or code P1129 - this code points to replacing the ECM or the Throttle Body depending. So either way they both point there. Odd though seeing I haven't had the problem (touch wood) since replacing the fuel loom with a spare. :-/ Edited January 24, 2013 by shifted (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shifted Posted February 25, 2013 Author Share Posted February 25, 2013 Well I spoke too soon!! Cut-out twice on me, this time only for a couple minutes though and the car started again no problem. Didn't have to wait 20 minutes like I did before, was only like 2-4min. So... hopefully getting a spare throttle body today (hopefully! From a '99 Aristo motor). Someone else mentioned to me that there is a pedal positioning sensor on the throttle body - could that be an issue? Anyway - in regard to the throttle override kit: http://www.supraforums.com.au/forum/a80-mkiv-discussion/83895-vvt-i-throttle-control-override-kit.html Heaps of pictures in there of what has to be done - I'm considering it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shifted Posted February 11, 2014 Author Share Posted February 11, 2014 Forgot about this thread. Turned out my issue was a loose positive battery terminal. Go figure. Replaced with a nice aftermarket item, car runs like a dream. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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