Intercooler and hybrids Q (UK spec)

[Keith C]

Started a new thread cos Adam's thread is for a J-spec.

 

I've got a UK TT6 with just an exhaust and bleed valve, although I've got a s/h boost controller coming in the next couple of months. Now my intercooler is starting to show its age a little, so I've been toying with the idea of replacing it. Unfortunately, my ins co won't entertain the idea of covering me with a nice big HKS jobbie.

 

Now I've got a contact that can make me a race-spec cooler of the same size as the stock item, to replace the stock jobbie, for about £350 or so. He supplies the 200SX guys with their coolers, and speaking to quite a few people in the 200SX club who should know, are extremely capable items, about twice as good as standard for the same size. Best thing is that the ins co will cover the IC for no increase in premium!

 

However, I'm also planning hybrids in the future - what I'm wondering is, will an even twice as efficient stock-size cooler be able to cope with hybrids? Also, what else would I need for hybrids? As I understand it, having UK-spec fuelling means I shouldn't have to replace any of the fuel system, but is there anything else I have to do to get the fuelling right?

 

The thing I like most is dollops of mid-range torque, but I also want to to pull hard up to the redline, unlike the current setup which drops off sharply above 5000 (although that's largely down to the boost dropping due to it only being a bleed valve). I want to keep at least some of the very low torque, which means keeping the sequentials, but I'm happy to trade some lag for mid-range.

 

Basically, I just want to discuss the best way to go about things with people who know.

 

Cheers

[Alex]

Sounds like a plan....

 

Maybe take that SMIC - add some Water Injection and add a direct cold feed to your intake....something subtle yet effective.

 

Make sure you get an EGT gauge and you might want to think about a temp gauge for the intake system...probably plumbed in before the WI...maybe in the vertical pipe next to the battery....or one in the intake manifold.

 

CW should be able to advise you.....

[randy]

You would need a Fuel Computer and a Boost Controller-

[Guest Martin F]

Originally posted by randy

You would need a Fuel Computer

 

 

Errr why ?

[Branners]

There are some aftermarket side mount ICs about, the problem is the Toyota one is very efficient and unless you have some specific way of proving that the new SMIC is better then you could well find its the same or worse. Im not sure if the 200sx intercooler is as well designed so they probably can get better efficiency out of an aftermarket unit.

 

Why would the insurance company not entertain the FMIC? It doesnt really boost power as such (well maybe a little bit), its more of a safety measure to avoid higher intake charges.

 

I found the FMIC on my Supra made no difference at all to my 1/4 mile times, it just meant I had better power on hot days.

 

JB

[randy]

Originally posted by Martin F

 

 

Errr why ?

 

Running high boost say 25/28psi (with or without race gas) on hybrids you may be running short of fuel at certain RMP''s. To get the optimum Air Fuel Ratio a S-AFC would be of good use to richen things up a bit to be on the safer side.

[Guest Martin F]

Originally posted by randy

 

To get the optimum Air Fuel Ratio a S-AFC would be of good use to richen things up a bit to be on the safer side.

 

So it's not a necessity ?

[GavinL]

Originally posted by randy

 

Running high boost say 25/28psi (with or without race gas) on hybrids you may be running short of fuel at certain RMP''s. To get the optimum Air Fuel Ratio a S-AFC would be of good use to richen things up a bit to be on the safer side.

 

I think running hybrids at 28PSI (2 bar?) would be the exception to the rule.

 

It could happen but from what I understand UK spec cars with the bigger injectors don't require a fuel computer with hybrid turbo's.

[Ian C]

That's an interesting question, actually, as hybrids are supposed to give you more air at the same pressure, because it's cooler. Hybrids running at 0.8bar is more air than j-spec at 0.8bar.

 

So, wouldn't you need to richen the mix across the rev range? The ECU is seeing the same pressure, but more fuel is required in the mix due to a denser air charge being delivered? Unless the intake air temperature sensor deals with this and richens it up, thinking it's just a sort of colder day. I wonder how much of an influence the intake temperature sensor has on the fuelling. Anyone know?

 

-Ian

[eyefi]

Originally posted by Ian C

I wonder how much of an influence the intake temperature sensor has on the fuelling. Anyone know?

 

 

i would imagine alot.

[Guest Martin F]

Originally posted by eyefi

 

i would imagine alot.

 

But if that is the case, then you would have to ask why do we have to worry about high intake temps in the summer if the ECU can adjust fuelling dependent on the intake charge temp sensors' reading ?

 

Additional fuel would protect against knock and cool the intake charge further.

 

I have a feeling it may not play as big a part as we think, then again it's probably different between UK and Jap spec.

[Keith C]

I thought the MAF sensor measured how much air went through, irrelevant of what pressure it was at or anything - ie, more dense air=cooler air=more power needed to keep the wire at the same temp

 

As for the IC design, it's from a company that make race-spec IC's for assorted racing teams, apparently to an equivalent spec as Radtech ones. It'll also be custom made to fit in the sidepod, ie it's not a 200SX design, just from someone who supplies SX IC's.

 

Interesting, my ins co said they would cover a Pace jobbie, but not a HKS one - ie not one of the more 'common' makes. Also, I want to keep my active spoiler, which rules out a large FMIC. My intention is to keep the car looking as standard as possible while making it lots faster

 

As for boost, isn't the 25+psi range only for US drag racers who want to blow up their engines! I'd like about 1.2bar or so, held throughout the range, properly fuelled, well cooled, to make a nice wodge of reliable torque.

[eyefi]

**** im not an expert, what follows is theoretical and for debate purposes only ****

 

 

But if that is the case, then you would have to ask why do we have to worry about high intake temps in the summer if the ECU can adjust fuelling dependent on the intake charge temp sensors' reading ?

 

cos hot air in is no good anyway. it kills power, makes the engine run hotter, eventually leading to detonation or even worse preignition.

 

Additional fuel would protect against knock and cool the intake charge further.

 

thats true, but extra fuel will only cool the chamber temp to a certain extent, and that also robs power and is no good for the chamber (bore wash). plus ud get shitty mpg and we wouldnt want that

 

I have a feeling it may not play as big a part as we think, then again it's probably different between UK and Jap spec.

 

its got to. its there for a purpose. the ecu has to know how many air molecules (there abouts) r in that chamber. it cant do it on pressure alone, it also needs to know the temp of the charged air to get its maths right.