Rich Posted November 25, 2005 Share Posted November 25, 2005 Sorry but I cannot see it m8 - never get there without the EGT's going through the stratosphere 26-28 psi - nearly 2 bar?! is that an Increase of 350??? Not an increase of 350 - if the stock is approx 280 - than these give you an additional 70 etc. I personally would not run them at anywhere near this as the EGT increases I suspect will be too great. So we come back to the 1.4 and approx 50hp increase So if you are making 350 HP on anyones Dyno - add another 50 achieved to that etc Unless you have a real reason to stay hybrid (and there are some- cost / insurance etc etc) them go single all day long - but be prepared to spend A LOT of money over stock hi just found this thread,thought id bring it back from the dead,as I couldnt reply ages back due to my membership expiring. the car made 473 hp at the hubs and 451 lb/ft of torque at 1.4 bar with no detting.the highest the egts ever got were 720 degrees (with egt probe mounted in downpipe).I had a few toys in there that werent in my sig,but 500fwhp is quite easily attainable with decent spec hybrids and supporting mods,more can be squeezed out if you run a bit of cool blue! the car is still running strong 1 and a half years later so it cant be detting othrwise the engine would have popped by now.I think that much over 500hp and the seq system becomes restrictive and dangerous . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BURT Posted November 25, 2005 Share Posted November 25, 2005 i am still considering the two, and was also led to believe that 500hp was achievable and wouldnt put that much stress on the engine, so whats the verdict, single or twins if i want 500hp with an auto box? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted November 25, 2005 Share Posted November 25, 2005 your options are hybrids as the cheap way of achieving it or the expensive way is a small single .the choice is yours its all down to money.:)also you can get away with not declaring hybrids on your insurance as they can not be seen but a single is very obvious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Harwood Posted November 26, 2005 Share Posted November 26, 2005 Whilst 500 fwhp may be achievable with hybrids, (just IMHO), I would suggest that that really is on the limit. Firstly, you'd have to be confident that you can get a decent set of hybrids. I've driven many cars and seen many perform with hybrids, and they very from laggier than stock, to slightly better than stock, to quite reasonable. I've never been in a Supra with any hybrids that 'blew me away', but some are definatly better than others. Secondly, at this point, the manifold is going to be a restriction and the tiny turbos are going to be out of their effeciency range and starting to produce a lot of heat. If, as Richie says, his EGT's were 720 degrees at the downpipe, although I've never actually done any position testing myself, I do trust Chris Wilson and he suggested that you'd be likely to lose 200 degrees or so over that distance. So that makes a rough guestimate of over 900 degrees in cylinder temps... Starting to get too hot for comfort for a top speed run IMO. Hybrids themselves don't actually put any stress on the engine itself. It's the setting up of the hybrids and fuelling and how far out of their designed range you try to push them. Both will cause excessive heat and lead to melting pistons. A single kit WILL cost more, but where as 500 bhp really is about the maximum you could get from a decent set of hybrids, (and you'll still need bigger injectors and a fuel controller), single conversions virtually start at 500 bhp, (depending on what size turbo you go for and what boost you plan to run), and if set up properly they'll be more reliable as the set-up is far simpler, and there is still more scope for further power increases when-ever you feel the need. All IMHO of course Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted November 27, 2005 Share Posted November 27, 2005 Whilst 500 fwhp may be achievable with hybrids, (just IMHO), I would suggest that that really is on the limit. Firstly, you'd have to be confident that you can get a decent set of hybrids. I've driven many cars and seen many perform with hybrids, and they very from laggier than stock, to slightly better than stock, to quite reasonable. I've never been in a Supra with any hybrids that 'blew me away', but some are definatly better than others. Secondly, at this point, the manifold is going to be a restriction and the tiny turbos are going to be out of their effeciency range and starting to produce a lot of heat. If, as Richie says, his EGT's were 720 degrees at the downpipe, although I've never actually done any position testing myself, I do trust Chris Wilson and he suggested that you'd be likely to lose 200 degrees or so over that distance. So that makes a rough guestimate of over 900 degrees in cylinder temps... Starting to get too hot for comfort for a top speed run IMO. Hybrids themselves don't actually put any stress on the engine itself. It's the setting up of the hybrids and fuelling and how far out of their designed range you try to push them. Both will cause excessive heat and lead to melting pistons. A single kit WILL cost more, but where as 500 bhp really is about the maximum you could get from a decent set of hybrids, (and you'll still need bigger injectors and a fuel controller), single conversions virtually start at 500 bhp, (depending on what size turbo you go for and what boost you plan to run), and if set up properly they'll be more reliable as the set-up is far simpler, and there is still more scope for further power increases when-ever you feel the need. All IMHO of course putting a t61 spec turbo on is the way to go ,but its the cost of going single if you do it properly with no shortcuts,it gets expensive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BURT Posted November 28, 2005 Share Posted November 28, 2005 i have spoke to Dan at turbo technics, he has assured me that with thier hybrids you can expect 600 bhp at full boost with supporting mods. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Terry S Posted November 28, 2005 Share Posted November 28, 2005 i have spoke to Dan at turbo technics, he has assured me that with thier hybrids you can expect 600 bhp at full boost with supporting mods. Does he own a Supra then? Ask him at what boost/egt's Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BURT Posted November 28, 2005 Share Posted November 28, 2005 1.8 bar, egt' 850 approx. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BURT Posted November 28, 2005 Share Posted November 28, 2005 water injection. I am only going on what people tell me, but surley this would help reduce the egt's, and with correct fueling and mapping? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Terry S Posted November 28, 2005 Share Posted November 28, 2005 its not gonna happen mate IMHO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted November 28, 2005 Share Posted November 28, 2005 1.8 bar on hybrids? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heckler Posted November 28, 2005 Share Posted November 28, 2005 1.8 bar on hybrids? i dont go above 1.4... generally 1.3 for me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted November 28, 2005 Share Posted November 28, 2005 i usually stay at about 1.2 bar with my hybrids Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BURT Posted November 28, 2005 Share Posted November 28, 2005 expert opinions are always weclome, what figures would you expct Terry, realisticly? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Terry S Posted November 28, 2005 Share Posted November 28, 2005 expert opinions are always weclome, what figures would you expct Terry, realisticly? 500 absolute tops with high EGT's Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BURT Posted November 28, 2005 Share Posted November 28, 2005 1.8 bar on hybrids? Turbo technics are saying that their hybrids are safe at 1.8bar (25 psi approx) and will warranty them for two years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Terry S Posted November 28, 2005 Share Posted November 28, 2005 Turbo technics are saying that their hybrids are safe at 1.8bar (25 psi approx) and will warranty them for two years. probably. But do they know the compression ratio of the engie, or the cooling system in depth. These people are selective in their info. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BURT Posted November 28, 2005 Share Posted November 28, 2005 500 absolute tops with high EGT's cheers Terry:respekt: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Posted November 28, 2005 Share Posted November 28, 2005 Turbo technics are saying that their hybrids are safe at 1.8bar (25 psi approx) and will warranty them for two years. But will they warrantee your melted pistons too? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BURT Posted November 28, 2005 Share Posted November 28, 2005 Hey, these are thier claims not mine fella, i'm just asking, i understend high egt's thats why i mentioned water injection. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BURT Posted November 28, 2005 Share Posted November 28, 2005 i dont go above 1.4... generally 1.3 for me what figures are you getting at 1.4 bar fella Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Terry S Posted November 28, 2005 Share Posted November 28, 2005 Hey, these are thier claims not mine fella, i'm just asking, i understend high egt's thats why i mentioned water injection. Not a problem mate. Few of us have heard it all before. I perservered with hybrids for ages before I saw the light Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Posted November 28, 2005 Share Posted November 28, 2005 It might be good idea to ask SupraChargedTT about his experience with Turbo Technics hybrids and their claims. IIRC he had some nasty problems with his ones Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted November 28, 2005 Share Posted November 28, 2005 1.4 bar is the way to go,like I said 473 at the hubs which is prob over 500 at the flywheel and egts never went over 920 degrees even on a top speed run. 950 is the highest you would reqally want to go.my egt gauge was set to warn me at 750 (egt probe mounted in downpipe) it never warned me once .if your cooling/fuelling is good they are fine. a cheap way to get to 500hp,not the best way ,but the price to going single is a lot more than people think-it may be better but it costs more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted November 28, 2005 Share Posted November 28, 2005 IMO 1.8 bar is way too high to run on hybrids on the supra,they will prob. run out of efficiency well before then. 1.4 bar is fine as long as you get it set up right.(fuelling check,egt check,good cooling) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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