Guest dave42 Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 Il'll try the same thing tonight Did u try it and did it make a difference? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Whiffin Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 So i'm assuming it would be simliar for me. Would you be able to tell me what this will be costing the customer? Its intersting that the gentlemans idea above worked (cranking the motor a couple of times without letting it fully start) and the noise was gone. Could that not suggest its just an oil pump/strainer problem or will dodgy cranks/bearings/rods etc cause a lack of oil flow? Costs really depend on what we find when its stripped down. It would be cheaper labour and parts wise to buy a decent 2nd hand engine. But then the same thing could happen 1 year down the road, might not. Like Chris says depends on how long your going to keep the car for and luck of the draw. If an engine has been subjected to any kind of oil starvation its going to cause wear. The problem is going to be an oil pressure fault somewhere along the line, either pump or something blocked, I would go with pump myself. I've built around 6 2JZ-GTE engines in the last month alone, 2 of them having similar bottom end problems and none of them had block strainers. Wont really know for sure until its stripped. Cheapest way will be new oil pump, check crank journals which may need lapping or regrind and a set of bearings. If you leave to get worse, it'll be the same but could be a new crank, rods or worst case another engine! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Epic Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 how much is a new oil pump? and where could i source one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Whiffin Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 Toyota UK price is £115 + VAT I believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Epic Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 do you think replacing the oil pump could fix the problem, or is it kind of a damage done situation.. thanks for the help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Whiffin Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 Did you read my original post? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Epic Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 Could i bring the car to whifbitz for a check? and if so, what would that set me back, feel free to PM if its better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Whiffin Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 To "check" it would involve removing the engine, you realise that I presume? Unless of course you just want us to listen to the noise? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Epic Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 no lol, as im a stupid idiot (pritty tierd, been a long day) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fifty Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 Epic just drive it its proably just injector noise. No disrespect to anyone here but diagnosing a fault like this through words? Rich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest dave42 Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 Epic just drive it its proably just injector noise. No disrespect to anyone here but diagnosing a fault like this through words? Rich Well i originally asked if someone could help with my problem. A kind member suggested something it could be and told me a way to check if that is the problem and if so i could do something which could help. Everything he said worked so to answer your question: Yes my fault was diagnosed through words. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fifty Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 yes I know I was actually thinking about Epics problem in that context. I am pleased you got sorted:p Sometimes folk on here get a little paranoic dont you find? Rich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest dave42 Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 yes I know I was actually thinking about Epics problem in that context. I am pleased you got sorted:p Sometimes folk on here get a little paranoic dont you find? Rich My apologies. When i saw you had written "epic" I thought you meant "epic thread" as in long thread but now i realise the person above was called Epic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest dave42 Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 Thanks also to Paul Whiffin for being very helpful. Paul, do you think it's worth changing the oil pump to see if that cures the problem. And is it even a job that one can do themselves? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Artermis Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 the knocking noise is a symptom of a worn part, in this case the shell bearings on the crank. you hear the noise because the shell bearing is now worn (assuming that the diagnosis above is correct). the wear on these bearings is accelerated by a lack of oil. replacing the oil pump may fix the fact that there was a lack of oil, replacing the oil pump as many times as you like will not fix the fact that your shell bearing is now worn. edit: has anyone thought to check their oil as well? of course with the cold settling in it will take an effect in the viscosity of the oil and a different rating maybe required? the owners handbook may shed light on which oil is best for certain temp ranges. fresh oil is always good too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bignum Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 Have you got an oil pressure gauge, i noticed my light staying on for a second about 3 years ago and does now, this ties in with oil pressure building. I would just do the crank before start thing and see if it gets any worse, obviously change the oil regularly and dont use shite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Whiffin Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 Thanks also to Paul Whiffin for being very helpful. Paul, do you think it's worth changing the oil pump to see if that cures the problem. And is it even a job that one can do themselves? No probs. You've got to take the sump off to do it which can be done in situ if you have the right tools for the job. The front subframe has got to be dropped down so the engine needs to be supported from the top somehow. We can do that here of course but really you should be thinking of bearings as well, they are going to be worn to some extent....You also said your valve stem seals are shot, in which case it would make sense to do a full engine rebuild. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike M Posted November 8, 2007 Share Posted November 8, 2007 Sometimes folk on here get a little paranoic dont you find? Rich I'm like that, mine does the opposite in that I can hear a light rattle when its fully warmed up. If I hold the revs around 2.5 - 3k then very gently increase them I hear a rattle that stops once revs are constant. BUT is it the engine or Dual mass flywheel??? who knows, if I find its getting noticeably worse quite quickly then I'll have to bite the bullet but for now shes getting pampered along. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bodilx6 Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 If you got an engine in perfect condition, how long should the oil pressure light be on (if at all), from the intant you tick over the engine? Should it turn of the second you go from "on" to "start"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
georigg Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 Just another quick point for anyone re-building, I've had similar problems on cars over the years and as some others have posted, it can result from wear in the oil pump. Oil pump clearances are very tight.....of the order of only a few thou( about 1.5 - 2thou at the rotor ends) when new and as they wear, oil will pass across the ends of the lobes, resulting in lower oil pressure. On cars where its easy to remove the sump, its a fairly easy job to remove the pump, grind in the rotor non drive end, then grind in the barrel to reduce the barrel-to-rotor clearance to about 1.5Thou, then grind in the end plate to remove wear rings. Wear on the end plate is where the greatest leakage occurs. Replacing the oil pump(or doing the above) can extend the life, even of a worn engine.......remember that the oil pressure developed is a function of oil flow rate & back pressure(clearances on bearings) in its simplest terms.....increase oil flow rate and oil pressure will increase! Which leads me on to the point of the post......if your doing a lot of work to the engine, always replace or overhaul the oil pump, a lot of folk forget about it after spending a fortune on a rebore & regrind. Rgds, George Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Epic Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 Where could i get a new oil pump, no harm in abit of peace of mind to protect my engine that bit more Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Wilson Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 Any Toyota main agent can get you one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kranz Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 If your problem is just on startup then one perhaps simpler solution (and may only be short term) is to fit an electric oil pump or oil accumulator. These can be plumbed in to supply oil pressure prior to engine start and to switch off when oil pressure has built up from the engine's oil pump. This will protect the engine from further damage, and also provide a backup if the main oil pump fails or can't supply sufficient pressure at hot idle. I had the knocking on startup & low idle pressure on my 3.2 Jag XJ6, so fitted an electric pump to 'assist' as I didn't want to get the engine out to change the pump. I'd just had the head off & even though it was at 150K miles the bores looked like new! The electric pump was plumbed into the sump and drew oil up & pumped it into the oil gallery through the filter. It came on with ignition on (unless I pulled a fuse) and switched off when the oil pressure light went off. It cured the start up rattle & kept the low oil pressure light off at idle after a long fast run during summer. This may be a short term fix, or it may last for many, many years. My Jag never got a new pump & I part exchanged it for the Supe Edit - Pump was £70 IIRC & I plumbed it in myself including the important non-return valve just before the feed to the oil gallery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Epic Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 sounds good.. where did you get this from? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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