scoooby slayer Posted July 17, 2011 Author Share Posted July 17, 2011 (edited) i have just been on 2 bar tuning web site dyno plots and found a comparable dyno graph. this is a gt42 which the t51r spl is built from so very similar turbos almost identical and on a 3400 cc. this is srr flywheel hp seems my boost is coming in very well in comparison tdi hub power looking at that as a comparison my boost seems to be coming in nice and early, maybe im expecting to much ? Edited July 17, 2011 by scoooby slayer (see edit history) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dude Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 I don't think you will improve that, still it wont hurt to get it on a dyno and see what diff the timing makes, you can come down and play on ours if you like it wont cost a fortune, looks like you make peak torque just as mine starts spooling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamieP Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 You cant compare to SRR mate, that rolling road wont load the engine at all and it will look to spool far slower, graph will look massivley different to the same car on a hub dyno, saying that the spool time on yours looks just about right to me for 3.4L and 76mm turbo, i dont think you have anything to worry about but i would still get it mapped by the best person out there, Ryan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoooby slayer Posted July 17, 2011 Author Share Posted July 17, 2011 I don't think you will improve that, still it wont hurt to get it on a dyno and see what diff the timing makes, you can come down and play on ours if you like it wont cost a fortune, looks like you make peak torque just as mine starts spooling. its awesome from 3rd gear up but can be tricky keeping in the power especially first to second, i guess abit higher rev limit would help but im not keen on that as hks recomend 7600 max. thanks for the offer may pop down at some point Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoooby slayer Posted July 17, 2011 Author Share Posted July 17, 2011 You cant compare to SRR mate, that rolling road wont load the engine at all and it will look to spool far slower, graph will look massivley different to the same car on a hub dyno, saying that the spool time on yours looks just about right to me for 3.4L and 76mm turbo, i dont think you have anything to worry about but i would still get it mapped by the best person out there, Ryan. i did ring ryan but he said as sam at tdi mapped it id be wasteing my money as hes one of the best out there. one thing is for certain when i fit the new head the cams will be getting dialled in to perfection on my engine stand. i have a mag mount dial gauge i use on the cat back ends for cross shaft back lash etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dude Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 You cant compare to SRR mate, that rolling road wont load the engine at all and it will look to spool far slower, graph will look massivley different to the same car on a hub dyno, saying that the spool time on yours looks just about right to me for 3.4L and 76mm turbo, i dont think you have anything to worry about but i would still get it mapped by the best person out there, Ryan. I would not worry about mapping till its known what happens with the timing being moved, at that power there is nothing wrong with a chassis dyno, if a hub dyno puts too much load in thats not how it will behave on the road anyway, and like I keep saying the dyno is ONLY a tool to tune a cra and see if you are going backwards or forwards with mods, if he runs it on a chassis dyno and then alters it he can see if he goes back or forward and also if the spool alters, we have been on the phone to DD in Australia and they reckon we should be able to dyno MY car on our dyno with no problems at all, we can now run to 170mph without overspeeding and they have told us to tie it down differntly. Theres a lot of diff having a mapping session at TDI to popping it on our dyno and having a few runs to see what diff moving the timing wheels makes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dude Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 i did ring ryan but he said as sam at tdi mapped it id be wasteing my money as hes one of the best out there. one thing is for certain when i fit the new head the cams will be getting dialled in to perfection on my engine stand. i have a mag mount dial gauge i use on the cat back ends for cross shaft back lash etc. What cams are you going for?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan.G Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Moving the cams without mapping to suit is like having a crap and not wiping your arse. With different head gasket thickness and head skimming it changes everything on cam timing but what i can tell you is the way the cams are set up now they look to be definalty more advanced than they were before with the other turbo or you are getting valve bounce at 7200. The Torque drops on its arse. I would look to reducing the torque in the midrange with the cam timing and move the powerband up abit to help hold more torque to the redline making it a faster car. Some manufactures cam timing settings are great for power but create way too much overlap low down which creates not a nice road car so you have to set them up to suit the desired powerband. LeeP and I spent a while getting the ideal cam timing positions on his SRD cams for the road so he could set them the same each time and i rarely have to move them now as they peak power just before the desired engine builders rev limiter. Ryan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan.G Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Dual VVTI is definatly the answer though. I have been spending alot of time getting the cam timing right on the new RG TVR Speed six cylinder head for which we have now got 430bhp out of a 4l N/A.... but i told them that to get the best from it they need dual vvti.... 4 weeks later i get this picture http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=213344728709907&set=a.213344722043241.55910.210633775647669&type=1&theater Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dude Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 Moving the cams without mapping to suit is like having a crap and not wiping your arse. With different head gasket thickness and head skimming it changes everything on cam timing but what i can tell you is the way the cams are set up now they look to be definalty more advanced than they were before with the other turbo or you are getting valve bounce at 7200. The Torque drops on its arse. I would look to reducing the torque in the midrange with the cam timing and move the powerband up abit to help hold more torque to the redline making it a faster car. Some manufactures cam timing settings are great for power but create way too much overlap low down which creates not a nice road car so you have to set them up to suit the desired powerband. LeeP and I spent a while getting the ideal cam timing positions on his SRD cams for the road so he could set them the same each time and i rarely have to move them now as they peak power just before the desired engine builders rev limiter. Ryan I was a bit miffed that the cams I have dont come with degree instructions, all the runs at TDI were cams set at 0 on both, now we have a slightly diff turbo with the 1.32 divided housing we will habve to start playing again. Lee's cams are like a work of art compared to mine and are now my first choice as replacements. When you gonna have a peak at my settings dude ????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan.G Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 i did ring ryan but he said as sam at tdi mapped it id be wasteing my money as hes one of the best out there. He is indeed one person i rate and i stated that as Sam mapped it before you might as well get him to finish it. Would work out cheaper this way also for you. Some would say im stupid for turning work away but Sam is a friend and i feel he would be happy to finish it off. If he is not then give us another Ring Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan.G Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 I was a bit miffed that the cams I have dont come with degree instructions, all the runs at TDI were cams set at 0 on both, now we have a slightly diff turbo with the 1.32 divided housing we will habve to start playing again. Lee's cams are like a work of art compared to mine and are now my first choice as replacements. When you gonna have a peak at my settings dude ????? Im always on the other end of the phone for you guys and happy to come drive the dyno and lend a hand at the next mapping session. Sometimes though too many mappers spoils the tune I need to ensure you do well though as you are running a Syvecs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan.G Posted July 17, 2011 Share Posted July 17, 2011 I would not worry about mapping till its known what happens with the timing being moved, at that power there is nothing wrong with a chassis dyno, if a hub dyno puts too much load in thats not how it will behave on the road anyway, and like I keep saying the dyno is ONLY a tool to tune a cra and see if you are going backwards or forwards with mods, if he runs it on a chassis dyno and then alters it he can see if he goes back or forward and also if the spool alters, we have been on the phone to DD in Australia and they reckon we should be able to dyno MY car on our dyno with no problems at all, we can now run to 170mph without overspeeding and they have told us to tie it down differntly. Theres a lot of diff having a mapping session at TDI to popping it on our dyno and having a few runs to see what diff moving the timing wheels makes. Dont get me wrong i tune on a DD Dyno nearly everyday but with big power cars over 700hp the energy through the tyres just causes the runs to never be consistent and when tuning timing be it ignition or cam you need a dyno which has the least amount of variables between the flywheel and the dyno pack. Engine dyno is the way forward and im so tempted to get a superflow with alot of the new designed engines im working with but i just dont think many will want to spend the extra getting it done this way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoooby slayer Posted July 17, 2011 Author Share Posted July 17, 2011 Moving the cams without mapping to suit is like having a crap and not wiping your arse. With different head gasket thickness and head skimming it changes everything on cam timing but what i can tell you is the way the cams are set up now they look to be definalty more advanced than they were before with the other turbo or you are getting valve bounce at 7200. The Torque drops on its arse. I would look to reducing the torque in the midrange with the cam timing and move the powerband up abit to help hold more torque to the redline making it a faster car. Some manufactures cam timing settings are great for power but create way too much overlap low down which creates not a nice road car so you have to set them up to suit the desired powerband. LeeP and I spent a while getting the ideal cam timing positions on his SRD cams for the road so he could set them the same each time and i rarely have to move them now as they peak power just before the desired engine builders rev limiter. Ryan thanks ryan in that case i will leave it as it is as i dont want to loose any of the low down power, il will ask you to set the cams up and map once the new heads is on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greeny Posted July 18, 2011 Share Posted July 18, 2011 I was a bit miffed that the cams I have dont come with degree instructions Doesn't fill you with confidence when they haven't spent the time to do this! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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