b_have Posted April 14, 2008 Share Posted April 14, 2008 I Also, there is a bolt in the middle of the top of the wastegate which is fully done up. It was like this when i got it so i assumed it should be like this. QUOTE] That is the spring preload adjuster, try backing it right off. Think thats your problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean1933 Posted April 14, 2008 Author Share Posted April 14, 2008 Sean you will need a high pressure line to test the gate, we have a fitting we can attach to apply different pressure ranges so we can preload the spring or test which spring rate is in the gate. works like this.. Problem is, if the valve is sticking when hot this test wont show it, you could try stripping the gate down and polishing and lubing the shaft up to make sure its not sticking, and also make sure the valve isnt sticking in the lower seat. Aslo try a good hardline such as fuel hose incase (if your using it) the Silicon line is ballooning when it heats up. Will have a looky at that vid when i get home tonight as i cant view it at work. However, i find it hard to believe the shaft is sticking as the WG has only covered approx 1000miles. I will pull it apart and give it a clean anyway though. Can you clarify that if i was to pump the side port up (top port left open) to 1 bar or whatever pressure, then stop pumping...it should hold that pressure? Or does it gradually bleed? Reason i ask is because it doesnt seem to hold pressure, it gradually drops off. That is the spring preload adjuster' date=' try backing it right off. Think thats your problem.[/quote'] I did wonder about this mate, however it came like that so i assume thats how it was when fitted to the car. Im going to clean the gate up then give it a go with the bolt right out. I can see how this would increase the opening pressure, however i would still expect it to hold boost at some point and not just keep increasing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean1933 Posted April 14, 2008 Author Share Posted April 14, 2008 I have now pulled the WG apart and i cant say there is much untoward, very little play in the shaft but i assume thats normal . One thing i did wonder is how the preload screw can have any effect on it what so ever. The spring sits inside the top the housing and the screw just sits in the middle. Even fully wound in and the gate fully open it wouldnt be touching anything so how can it have any effect!? Should there be a plate there or something for it to push against which inturn pushes against the spring? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul mac Posted April 14, 2008 Share Posted April 14, 2008 I have now pulled the WG apart and i cant say there is much untoward, very little play in the shaft but i assume thats normal . One thing i did wonder is how the preload screw can have any effect on it what so ever. The spring sits inside the top the housing and the screw just sits in the middle. Even fully wound in and the gate fully open it wouldnt be touching anything so how can it have any effect!? Should there be a plate there or something for it to push against which inturn pushes against the spring? [ATTACH]74053[/ATTACH] yes your right the bolt would pre load a plate sat on the spring, whoever has done it has removed the plate and just left the bolt in to blank it, you have got the port next to the bolt open have you ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b_have Posted April 14, 2008 Share Posted April 14, 2008 Hmm, looks like there might be something missing, some kind of spring hat? Mine is a 60mm HKS, the preload adjuster def makes a difference to opening threshhold. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul mac Posted April 14, 2008 Share Posted April 14, 2008 Hmm' date=' looks like there might be something missing, some kind of spring hat? Mine is a 60mm HKS, the preload adjuster def makes a difference to opening threshhold.[/quote'] with the plate in if you wind the bolt in it will increase the boost pressure the valve relieves at, wind it out and/or remove the plate it will decrease the pressure so in Sean case it will make no difference, ie with the plate in it would make the situation worse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul mac Posted April 14, 2008 Share Posted April 14, 2008 Sean just looking at the pic again it looks like you have the top port (the one next to the redundant pre load screw) blanked, if this is the case that is you problem, in just a wastegate operated system (no boost controller) that port should be open to atmosphere Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean1933 Posted April 14, 2008 Author Share Posted April 14, 2008 Sean just looking at the pic again it looks like you have the top port (the one next to the redundant pre load screw) blanked, if this is the case that is you problem, in just a wastegate operated system (no boost controller) that port should be open to atmosphere The top port was open to atmosphere Paul, its just the angle of the photo. I must same im quite pissed that theres something missing from the WG though, obviously shows its been opened before which is worrying! However im assuming it shouldnt make a difference if im using a boost controller, its just like have the screw all the way out. Im stumped Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaz1 Posted April 14, 2008 Share Posted April 14, 2008 The top port was open to atmosphere Paul, its just the angle of the photo. I must same im quite pissed that theres something missing from the WG though, obviously shows its been opened before which is worrying! However im assuming it shouldnt make a difference if im using a boost controller, its just like have the screw all the way out. Im stumped i hate to think it was opened before sean as it was working fine when i had it, i bought it brand new but if it has then them bas*rds are still costing me money even now, will sort it if it is don,t worry;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean1933 Posted April 14, 2008 Author Share Posted April 14, 2008 Makes sure they get whats coming to them Gaz. Its def been opened though...which if its come from the same people i think were talking about then that worries me even more. Anyone know if there is a way to tell if the bottom half of a WG is HKS too, not just the top cup? Im sure its the full unit (ie not an XS power bottom half), just makes you wonder what they would try next doesnt it! To be honest im not even that fussed that its been opened, i just want my car working now, really getting me down.......goes off in search of my mate Jack Daniels. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul mac Posted April 14, 2008 Share Posted April 14, 2008 The top port was open to atmosphere Paul, its just the angle of the photo. I must same im quite pissed that theres something missing from the WG though, obviously shows its been opened before which is worrying! However im assuming it shouldnt make a difference if im using a boost controller, its just like have the screw all the way out. Im stumped dont worry about the missing plate, i binned mine so i could run 0.8, 1.2 and 1.4 bar boost, lets go back to basics fella, is your wastegate connected to the side port direct from the turbo compressor housing ?, what does your dump tube look like ? have you modded it ?, have you tried it without the dump tube? what diameter is the tube coming off the manifold that feeds the wastegate ? is the diaphram on the wastegate torn (just a pin hole will knacker it up so check carefully) ?, cant see the flanges on the wastegate but you have got it the right way ie the base of the wastegate piston facing the incoming exhaust (not the side), how much play is there in the valve stem on the wastegate, how many times can i type wastegate !?, finally get some copper slip on the wastegate stem and reassemble and try again Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean1933 Posted April 14, 2008 Author Share Posted April 14, 2008 dont worry about the missing plate, i binned mine so i could run 0.8, 1.2 and 1.4 bar boost, lets go back to basics fella, is your wastegate connected to the side port direct from the turbo compressor housing ?, what does your dump tube look like ? have you modded it ?, have you tried it without the dump tube? what diameter is the tube coming off the manifold that feeds the wastegate ? is the diaphram on the wastegate torn (just a pin hole will knacker it up so check carefully) ?, cant see the flanges on the wastegate but you have got it the right way ie the base of the wastegate piston facing the incoming exhaust (not the side), how much play is there in the valve stem on the wastegate, how many times can i type wastegate !?, finally get some copper slip on the wastegate stem and reassemble and try again *Boost signal source is in the intercooler pipe straight off of the compressor housing, probably 3-4 inches from where the housing ends. *Its an XS power manifold, however Gaz had it honed out due to flow problems which didnt return after. I will measure the pipe if needs be tomorrow. *Sensor line is connected to the side port. Top port has been left vented to atmosphere for test purposes. *No holes or tears in diaphram from what i can see. *WG fitted correctly, Dump tube is only approx 5inches long with a 45degree bend in it. I havent tried it without but will do when i refit the gate tomorrow. *How do i define alot of play (in the shaft)? Doesnt seem much though. I will copper slip it before i refit tomorrow. *You said wastegate 8 times in your last post! and i lost count of how many withing this thread Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul mac Posted April 14, 2008 Share Posted April 14, 2008 *Boost signal source is in the intercooler pipe straight off of the compressor housing, probably 3-4 inches from where the housing ends. now thats the only thing that makes me go hummmm, have you seen it work like that on other supras as i have seen a lot of single installs and all seemed to be straight off the compressor housing, was it working like this when Gaz had it wastegate wastegate wastegate wastegate wastegate wastegate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean1933 Posted April 14, 2008 Author Share Posted April 14, 2008 now thats the only thing that makes me go hummmm, have you seen it work like that on other supras as i have seen a lot of single installs and all seemed to be straight off the compressor housing, was it working like this when Gaz had it wastegate wastegate wastegate wastegate wastegate wastegate Gaz didnt have it fitted like that, however i have seen it on other supras like that. As long as its before the throttle plate and ideally before the FMIC (due to pressure drop), then there is no reason why it wouldnt work. If it still doesnt work after i put it all back together then i may T a boost gauge into that feed line, just to check its feeding correctly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul mac Posted April 15, 2008 Share Posted April 15, 2008 Gaz didnt have it fitted like that, however i have seen it on other supras like that. As long as its before the throttle plate and ideally before the FMIC (due to pressure drop), then there is no reason why it wouldnt work. If it still doesnt work after i put it all back together then i may T a boost gauge into that feed line, just to check its feeding correctly. for the work involved personally i would tap a hole into the compressor housing, its one more thing to eliminate, i would not bother with the boost gauge as it would be very difficult to drive the car on boost and try watching the gauge Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wez Posted April 15, 2008 Share Posted April 15, 2008 I feed my wastegate from the back of my inlet manifold and dont suffer any boost control issues Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean1933 Posted April 15, 2008 Author Share Posted April 15, 2008 I feed my wastegate from the back of my inlet manifold and dont suffer any boost control issues It shouldnt be a problem taking the feed from there, especially if your controlling boost with a controller. The position of the source is only REALLY important if you intend to run off just the WG spring as taking it from your location would probably make it run slightly more boost than that of the spring...due to the drop in pressure caused by cooling etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean1933 Posted April 15, 2008 Author Share Posted April 15, 2008 Well ive put it all back together and refitted, along with making sure there are no leaks...again. Its still overboosting . Im now starting to wonder if it could be the manifold as thats all thats left and the WG didnt really look like it had anything wrong with it from what i could gather. Anyone got a 4 bolt WG i can borrow for a few hours just to rule that out? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean1933 Posted April 16, 2008 Author Share Posted April 16, 2008 Anyone? Just tried it without the screamer..no change. How would/could i test the flow of the manifold WG port? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan.G Posted April 17, 2008 Share Posted April 17, 2008 Wasn't the turbo that gaz running damaged though on the exhaust side. As that will be why it ran alright on his .....but with a new turbine wheel on the new turbo is will be alot more efficient and probably the reason why its creeping. Ryan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean1933 Posted April 17, 2008 Author Share Posted April 17, 2008 I did consider that mate, however i assumed the tubby was fine when he actually had the manifold honed by D-Turner. Maybe that assumption was a mistake. I will pull it apart tonight and see what i can see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaz1 Posted April 17, 2008 Share Posted April 17, 2008 I did consider that mate, however i assumed the tubby was fine when he actually had the manifold honed by D-Turner. Maybe that assumption was a mistake. I will pull it apart tonight and see what i can see. the tubby was brand new when fitted to the manifold when the wastegate port was found to be restrictive, but as said before sean i think you need to check the port as you have a genuine gt40/88, and as i have learned i had a lorry one:blink: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan.G Posted April 17, 2008 Share Posted April 17, 2008 the tubby was brand new when fitted to the manifold when the wastegate port was found to be restrictive, but as said before sean i think you need to check the port as you have a genuine gt40/88, and as i have learned i had a lorry one:blink: Are you sure though Gaz as we are talking here about TF. Would also explain why it made very little power when DT mapped it. Ryan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean1933 Posted April 17, 2008 Author Share Posted April 17, 2008 Would also explain why it made very little power when DT mapped it. Ryan This did cross my mind. Im going to pull my tubby off tonight and have a look, i will also hopefully try gaz's old tubby at the weekend which should hopefully shed some light on things! I would like to know how exactly D-turner tested the flow of the manifold or was it just a trial and error thing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul mac Posted April 17, 2008 Share Posted April 17, 2008 This did cross my mind. Im going to pull my tubby off tonight and have a look, i will also hopefully try gaz's old tubby at the weekend which should hopefully shed some light on things! I would like to know how exactly D-turner tested the flow of the manifold or was it just a trial and error thing if this is the case i dont think you need to take the tubby apart mate you may need to look at the tube diameter that feeds the wastegate, when i first went single i had overboost issues as the wastegate was fed with a single pipe 35mm ID diameter (the same as the runners) i had to up this to 45mm ID and all was well in the land of overboost, interestingly i got the manifold secondhand and it came from quite a reputable guy off this forum, it had obviously been used and the guy swore blind he had no overboost issues so i put it down to higher ambient temps (he ran the car in Greece) and his choice of turbo, i have a T61 so not to sure on how this compares to yours Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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