Rich Posted January 12, 2005 Share Posted January 12, 2005 Thinking of running cool blue 103 or 113 when I race the car this year,will I get much of a gain from this without having a different fuel map? Is it worth buying,will be running 1.4 bar on hybrids. Seen a video from USA which is bpu car against bpu car with identical mods and race fuel,both with stock ecu's and the car on race fuel is a hell of a lot faster than the car without! Has anybody tried cool blue in a car on stock based turbos with no specific map for the race fuel,and what should I go for 103 ron or 113 ron>? thanks ,Richie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Posted January 12, 2005 Share Posted January 12, 2005 I've run 113 Octane at Santa Pod. It didn't make any noticable difference to performance. I was under the impression that the higher octane fuel itself doesn't give any more power. It's just safer because you can run more boost etc without getting detonation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorin Posted January 12, 2005 Share Posted January 12, 2005 I've run at York on Cool Blue, it did maybe seem slightly more responsive but I might have just been imagining it. Only did a couple of runs before my clutch went so didn't get to test it out too much. You'll need to pull the ECU fuses for 30 seconds or so to reset it to get the best out of the increased octane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Posted January 12, 2005 Share Posted January 12, 2005 You'll need to pull the ECU fuses for 30 seconds or so to reset it to get the best out of the increased octane. EFI fuse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Usmann A Posted January 12, 2005 Share Posted January 12, 2005 Its good stuff. Ive run some serious race fuel from 76. Its 114 mon, 120 ron+ but very expensive. Ive also tried some Elf turbo fuel = 106 ron, 91 mon. But saying all that cool blue should be fine if you arent racing heavily .. I gained 10rhhp at THOR ages ago on hybrids from running cool blue. Pulling the fuses, allows the ecu to advance igntion timing without DET due to the race fuel being more resistant to DET. so more power ... **edited** checking dyno chart it was 10rhhp.**edited** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted January 12, 2005 Author Share Posted January 12, 2005 Its good stuff. Ive run some serious race fuel from 76. Its 114 mon, 120 ron+ but very expensive. Ive also tried some Elf turbo fuel = 106 ron, 91 mon. But saying all that cool blue should be fine if you arent racing heavily .. I gained 10rhhp at THOR ages ago on hybrids from running cool blue. Pulling the fuses, allows the ecu to advance igntion timing without DET due to the race fuel being more resistant to DET. so more power ... **edited** checking dyno chart it was 10rhhp.**edited** Think ill have to try some 113 RON just to see if there is any difference in performance and for a bit of additional safety. How much is it for a barrel and what litre are they? anbody know? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Posted January 12, 2005 Share Posted January 12, 2005 You have a MINES ECU...it will make more use of it than a normal ECU...I'd try it.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Usmann A Posted January 12, 2005 Share Posted January 12, 2005 depends what fuel. I sue Sunco fuels(76) give them a call on 01929 551567. Closest to 113ron is Sunco supreme 114 ron, 110 mon race gas. Rough pricing £62 for 25 litres. next up is 55 litres=£129. Id stick with cool blue at your mods TBH, but thats IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MONKEYmark Posted January 12, 2005 Share Posted January 12, 2005 i tried KLUTZ or whatever its called 113 octane as it was same price as the 106 octane stuff, bought it for a saftey peace of mind thing. stock turbos only 1bar did not reset ecu or pull headlight with full weight car. got best time on it got some cool blue 106 or 107 octane to try out this year think its about £75 the klutz 113 octane was £45 for a 10l tin. its just supposed to stop det, and worth it for peace of mind. the c16 is supposed to be good. i have 1/4 of a tin of 113 octane to use at next event. there is an event next week at the pod , can see it been to clever if weather is cold and wet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted January 12, 2005 Author Share Posted January 12, 2005 depends what fuel. I sue Sunco fuels(76) give them a call on 01929 551567. Closest to 113ron is Sunco supreme 114 ron, 110 mon race gas. Rough pricing £62 for 25 litres. next up is 55 litres=£129. Id stick with cool blue at your mods TBH, but thats IMO. OK thanks for the advice i'll give them a bell tommorrow mate Richie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Usmann A Posted January 12, 2005 Share Posted January 12, 2005 its just supposed to stop det, and worth it for peace of mind. the c16 is supposed to be good. Yep. Mr Monkey is right. The race gas contains iso parafinns, and cyclo paraffins or napthenes which have stronger molecualar bonds which in turn are not so easily broken by Heat. Such as the normal parafinns lik kerosene and heptane. Basically, rae fuel has a strongr molecualr bonding, and slower combustion burning rate,(aromtic fuels =Toluol) which is not good for easy starts. Ill leave it there, fuel is a lenghty topic. HTH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted January 12, 2005 Author Share Posted January 12, 2005 i tried KLUTZ or whatever its called 113 octane as it was same price as the 106 octane stuff, bought it for a saftey peace of mind thing. stock turbos only 1bar did not reset ecu or pull headlight with full weight car. got best time on it got some cool blue 106 or 107 octane to try out this year think its about £75 the klutz 113 octane was £45 for a 10l tin. its just supposed to stop det, and worth it for peace of mind. the c16 is supposed to be good. i have 1/4 of a tin of 113 octane to use at next event. there is an event next week at the pod , can see it been to clever if weather is cold and wet. Where did you get the klutz fuel from monkey? are you going down to the pod next weekend if weather gets better,hopefully Ill have a few new toys to play with on strip if I get my finger out and get them fitted when they arrive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Posted January 12, 2005 Share Posted January 12, 2005 It's 'Klotz'. There's usually a guy selling it at Pod. I paid the same as MonkeyMark said, £45 for 10Ltrs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian C Posted January 12, 2005 Share Posted January 12, 2005 Race/turbo fuel is good news with single turbo cars as you can run about 1.4bar on Optimax before det creeps in, yet with race fuel you can wind it up beyond that, probably to 1.8bar, maybe even more if you are feeling rich Single turbos are perfectly capable of flowing such boost levels, stocker based turbos are at the edge of their abilities at 1.3bar so they can't really take advantage of the boost capabilities of the fuel Upping from 1.4bar to 1.8bar on a T67 should see you about 100bhp better off, as a seriously ballpark figure. -Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted January 12, 2005 Author Share Posted January 12, 2005 Race/turbo fuel is good news with single turbo cars as you can run about 1.4bar on Optimax before det creeps in, yet with race fuel you can wind it up beyond that, probably to 1.8bar, maybe even more if you are feeling rich Single turbos are perfectly capable of flowing such boost levels, stocker based turbos are at the edge of their abilities at 1.3bar so they can't really take advantage of the boost capabilities of the fuel Upping from 1.4bar to 1.8bar on a T67 should see you about 100bhp better off, as a seriously ballpark figure. -Ian going to go single turbo sometime this year,but want to get a good time on these hybrids before I ditch them.Tried running the hybrids at 1.5 bar and to be honest it felt no different to 1.4 ,which seems to be the limit on them for peak performance. do they do a dual ball bearing version of the t67?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Usmann A Posted January 12, 2005 Share Posted January 12, 2005 Ian, just for info, have you gone into DET territory above 1.4bar, ie, Logs of ingnition timing, and seeing the ECU pull it back? I assume you ovbioulsy have a correction factor for the timing, so do you see the actual timing the motor is doing while the signal is being fudged? Can the Emanage log knock sensor voltage?? PM, if you want, as iv got a greddy coming in to play with soon. Sorry for the slight hijack fellas. where were we ... ahh yess ... RACE FUEL =good DET= bad . :upside: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian C Posted January 13, 2005 Share Posted January 13, 2005 going to go single turbo sometime this year,but want to get a good time on these hybrids before I ditch them.Tried running the hybrids at 1.5 bar and to be honest it felt no different to 1.4 ,which seems to be the limit on them for peak performance. do they do a dual ball bearing version of the t67?? I did a test on my hybrids and at 1.5bar they were about 0.1 to 0.2s slower through 10mph increments to when I ran 1.3bar, so it lost some power and stressed the turbos unduly, anything over 1.3 to 1.4bar is futile on those dinky stock housings. I think there is a DBB version, drop Vortex a line, the £ over the 'normal' T67 is quite high though... -Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian C Posted January 13, 2005 Share Posted January 13, 2005 Ian, just for info, have you gone into DET territory above 1.4bar, ie, Logs of ingnition timing, and seeing the ECU pull it back? I assume you ovbioulsy have a correction factor for the timing, so do you see the actual timing the motor is doing while the signal is being fudged? Can the Emanage log knock sensor voltage?? PM, if you want, as iv got a greddy coming in to play with soon. Sorry for the slight hijack fellas. where were we ... ahh yess ... RACE FUEL =good DET= bad . :upside: Didn't go above 1.4bar as I had to back off the timing 7 degrees anyway to make it run OK there. I never tried advancing it, that's be madness on Optimax at those boost levels When the weather gets better I'll be doing more work on the ignition timing across the range. I can't see the actual timing, no, it's just a case of hear det = back off timing. It bloody well works though all those naysayers about the E-Manage not being able to control the MkIVs ignition were, how can I put this, wrong -Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Usmann A Posted January 13, 2005 Share Posted January 13, 2005 Hi Ian, Thanks for the reply. Sounds like a good unit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKI Posted January 15, 2005 Share Posted January 15, 2005 I know someone who ran a tank of pure toluene and managed some pretty amazing dyno results on BPU Supe with stock turbos, not sure what RON pure toluene equates too though. It wouldn't be within my budget to run that all the time But for a track/drag day.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tDR Posted January 15, 2005 Share Posted January 15, 2005 Pure Tol would cause engine damage! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted January 15, 2005 Author Share Posted January 15, 2005 I know someone who ran a tank of pure toluene and managed some pretty amazing dyno results on BPU Supe with stock turbos, not sure what RON pure toluene equates too though. It wouldn't be within my budget to run that all the time But for a track/drag day.... What results did they achieve at the dyno? was it at thor? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dude Posted January 15, 2005 Share Posted January 15, 2005 Matt H saw a massive increase in power on the dyno JUST from running 118 !!! so did i , it was in the region of 50 hp i believe , Guy couldnt believe it but we put it down to the extra timing the ECU's were throwing in we both have after market ECU's BTW 118 let me run @ 2.2 bar as well Dude :littled: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKI Posted January 16, 2005 Share Posted January 16, 2005 Richie, the guys name is chiefgroover, he posts on the other forum, he will probably send you a copy of his print out if you ask him! I can't find the copy he mailed me, but it was very impressive. I don't understand why pure toluene should damage the engine (caution noted though), what is more of a concern is the combustion products are highly carcinogenic so if you run toluene you want your windows up, and you don't want to get it on your skin! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorin Posted January 16, 2005 Share Posted January 16, 2005 I know someone who ran a tank of pure toluene and managed some pretty amazing dyno results on BPU Supe with stock turbos, not sure what RON pure toluene equates too though. It wouldn't be within my budget to run that all the time But for a track/drag day.... Toluene works out to about the same price as Optimax. Sounds a bit suspicious to me, a 10% mix of tol would be all you'd need, I supose you could add a little more but you'd want to add some kind of lubrication addative? 100% Toluene certainly wouldn't do your engine any good and I suspect thats probably an understatement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Please sign in to comment
You will be able to leave a comment after signing in
Sign In Now