cowboy bebop Posted April 16, 2008 Share Posted April 16, 2008 Well gents, we've cracked the code on the OEM Denso triple pump hangers. With some creative thinking and some special fittings, we've found the way to give the community what it wants and what I very much believe that it needs. If anyone has ever fit the OEM Denso's into the MKIV Supra, they'll know that the MKIV tank entance and slosh tray are rather small. We've worked hard to configure a way to fit the three larger OEM Supra pumps into the MKIV tank, and through CAD and exact measurement we've come up with the solution. Our billet hangers feature: T6 6061 construction Exact fit to the OEM tank Fittings supplied with each hanger Special sealing connector to accomodate the extra wiring All applicable hardware Area for grounds, and fuel level sensor Custom Supra OEM fuel pump triple cup Grooved posts giving a no slip grip to the fuel lines There has been a recent surge back to the OEM Supra pumps over the Walbro pumps in that the Supra pumps are reported to actually flow more than the Walbro (290L/hr vs. 255L/hr). Also the history of the in tank Walbros in the Supra world has been sketchy; even my old ones bame noisy and were on the way out. The OEM Supra pump RARELY fails. So what we have is higher flow w/ OEM reliability. Here is some info on the OEM Supra Denso pump courtesy of MKIV.com Toyota Supra Turbo Denso 195130-1020 Toyota 23221-46110 260 lph @ 43 psi; 220 lph @ 58 psi; @ 12 V 1. 290 lph @ 43 psi; 266 lph @ 58 psi @ 13.5 V 2. 290 lph @ 43 psi; 260 lph @ 58 psi; @ 14 V 1. Physical size of the Supra pump, you guys can understand that it's a larger in tank pump and that it takes bit on creative thinking to fit three in the tank and slosh tray without trimming. The pump hanger below is an example of our work. We've made this hanger for the 3rd gen Viper and on it can be seen the supplied fittings, grooved no-slip posts, and special fuel resistant sealed connector. The Triple OEM Supra Denso hanger will be very similar in construction with the same ultra high quality. As an introductary pre buy price, we're ready to release these at a world beating $435.00 per hanger. Test fit, and ready to roll out. You guys know that the USD is falling fast, and the GBP is stronger than ever, so the exchange rate is very favorable. We'd like to see at least 8 people in on the prebuy so that we may kick off production. Once on the list, please call MVP Motorsports at 940-683-8282 to confirm, or PM V8 Killer here on the forums. Sign up here: 1. Ken Henderson - Does not have an order with MVP yet 2. Gadfly 3. Tywash 4. Toyota Terrorist 5. XCELR8 6. Mr-B94TTsupra - Does not have an order with MVP yet 7. ISIS 8. Bolarbag (UK) - Does not have an order with MVP yet 9. Mrbil84 10. Reaper (AU) 11. Customer from AZ (not on SF) 12. yiros (AU) 13. SUPRASTITIOUS 14. suprahtt- Does not have an order with MVP yet 15. TT_6SPD_95 - Does not have an order with MVP yet 16. franksupra - Does not have an order with MVP yet 17. 18. 19. 20. 21. EDIT: We can supply the US export spec OEM Desno pumps with the hangers without a problem. The cost for each pump is a very reasonable 125gbp per. Just let either myself or V8 Killer know, and we can make a note of it on your reservation. Just for reference the reservation link has been put up. Thanks gents!! :) http://www.mvpmotorsports.com/Templates/frmTemplateM7.asp?SubFolderID=206 Eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz Walker Posted April 16, 2008 Share Posted April 16, 2008 Nice bit of kit. Would hate to think of the cost of one of them and 3 Denso pumps Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bolarbag Posted April 16, 2008 Share Posted April 16, 2008 Could you pm me a price on two denso's please, I already have twin walbro's but this sounds like a better setup, I'll not be needing 3 If they seem good I'll join If not would this hanger fit the Walbro's too? I gather these pumps are quieter than the Walbro's straight out the box? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowboy bebop Posted April 16, 2008 Author Share Posted April 16, 2008 It's the same pricing as there's no appreciable difference between a dual and a triple. Just one less pump in the tank and the extra port blocked off. The pumps that these are being made for are an OEM Supra pump so everyone should have at least one handy The OEM Supra pumps are large compared to the Walbros, however the Supra pumps flow more than the Walbros, and also have a great reliability record. I'm having a hard time finding where an OEM pump has dies due to heavy use. The track record of Walbros is sketchy from the testimonials we've read. Since it's an OEM pump, I would gather it being quieter than a Walbro but it's hard to say. Thanks! Eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowboy bebop Posted April 16, 2008 Author Share Posted April 16, 2008 Nice bit of kit. Would hate to think of the cost of one of them and 3 Denso pumps Every owner should have at least one OEM pump handy People give those pumps away. Thanks Gaz! Eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz Walker Posted April 16, 2008 Share Posted April 16, 2008 Every owner should have at least one OEM pump handy People give those pumps away. Thanks Gaz! Eric Hi Eric, Most of the cars in the UK are Japanese spec though, running the smaller JDM pumps, so a little more expensive to upgrade. Gaz. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowboy bebop Posted April 16, 2008 Author Share Posted April 16, 2008 Definitely an upgrade though. With all of the Walbros that folks went insane over in teh past years, somewhere there's a mountain of the OEM Denso pumps. I remember friends of mine would just give them away. They didn't know what they had. Thanks! Eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bolarbag Posted April 17, 2008 Share Posted April 17, 2008 So any idea how much these US/UK spec Denso's are? - Brand New And do the Walbro's fit in this new CNC'd holder? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowboy bebop Posted April 17, 2008 Author Share Posted April 17, 2008 The Walbro's don't fit in these cups as the Walbros' was too small. The US Spec OEM Densos are very large in comparison. Brand new the US spec OEM Denso's can run ~125GBP per give or take. I got mine for 62.5GBP becuase I got lucky. As I was telling the US guys, there's been people who've killed the Walbros at the WORST possible time, and lost a motor over it. Check the two threads in the first post, and you guys can see that its' not all the uncommon for the Walbros to quit working. I very much consider the OEM Supra Denso pumps to be cheap insurance. Thanks ! Eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer Posted April 17, 2008 Share Posted April 17, 2008 Thats a fantastic price on the US/UK spec pump. However I don't ever recall hearding of a walbro pump problem, and there are many hundreds (maybe thousands) of cars here with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_Shane_ Posted April 17, 2008 Share Posted April 17, 2008 would ya not have a lot lot more people interested if this was made to allow the walbro pumps be fitted to Im interested in this for my uk spec tt , convince me to buy it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharpie Posted April 17, 2008 Share Posted April 17, 2008 That is a good price for a Export spec OEM (new) pump Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowboy bebop Posted April 17, 2008 Author Share Posted April 17, 2008 Thats a fantastic price on the US/UK spec pump. However I don't ever recall hearding of a walbro pump problem, and there are many hundreds (maybe thousands) of cars here with them. There's many reports of Walbro's dying here in the states. I had three in tank pumps in my white Supra, and they were on the way out. They got very loud towards the end. There have been reports of Supra powering down the track when one of the three pumps quit, and the reult was the motor blew out. So far, I can't find any reports of the stock pump failing. That only covers the reliability issue. The other side of the coin is the fact that the stock pumps flow more than the Walbros at a given voltage. Thanks! Eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowboy bebop Posted April 17, 2008 Author Share Posted April 17, 2008 would ya not have a lot lot more people interested if this was made to allow the walbro pumps be fitted to Im interested in this for my uk spec tt , convince me to buy it What would you like to know man? Denso's have more flow and much better track record reliability. In short if a Supra owner is to the point where he's using multiple in tank pumps, why risk a pump faultering and quite possibly grenade the motor? Why not just run multiple OEM pumps, and be safe about it? Thanks! Eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AshBhp Posted April 17, 2008 Share Posted April 17, 2008 What diameter are the Denso pump's ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowboy bebop Posted April 17, 2008 Author Share Posted April 17, 2008 1.9 inches ~48mm. Thanks ! Eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer Posted April 17, 2008 Share Posted April 17, 2008 There's many reports of Walbro's dying here in the states. I had three in tank pumps in my white Supra, and they were on the way out. They got very loud towards the end. There have been reports of Supra powering down the track when one of the three pumps quit, and the reult was the motor blew out. So far, I can't find any reports of the stock pump failing. That only covers the reliability issue. The other side of the coin is the fact that the stock pumps flow more than the Walbros at a given voltage. I fully understand you US guys take things to limits we rarely see in the UK. I'm surprised they didn't have any sort of monitoring/fuel shut off in place to allow for a pump failure? I'd never want to run a multi-pump setup without a failsafe built in. One more thing, please refer to them as the stock export spec pump on this forum, the vast majority of cars here are JDM imports which use the lower rate pump and I wouldn't want people to assume their "stock" pump is capable at even BPU levels (it generally isn't). What do the US folks think of the Bosch 044 pumps? Are they in common to use on high spec cars? I plan on using one for my GM V8 conversion and the spec sheets show it far out performing any of the Denso pumps. On the down side, they are pretty expensive in comparison. TIA Edit - forgot to say that the hanger looks like a very nice piece of engineering, but interest in the UK is going to be pretty limited Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowboy bebop Posted April 17, 2008 Author Share Posted April 17, 2008 I fully understand you US guys take things to limits we rarely see in the UK. I'm surprised they didn't have any sort of monitoring/fuel shut off in place to allow for a pump failure? I'd never want to run a multi-pump setup without a failsafe built in. One more thing, please refer to them as the stock export spec pump on this forum, the vast majority of cars here are JDM imports which use the lower rate pump and I wouldn't want people to assume their "stock" pump is capable at even BPU levels (it generally isn't). What do the US folks think of the Bosch 044 pumps? Are they in common to use on high spec cars? I plan on using one for my GM V8 conversion and the spec sheets show it far out performing any of the Denso pumps. On the down side, they are pretty expensive in comparison. TIA Can do Homer, from now on they'll be known as stock export spec. The Bosch 044 pumps are catching on as well. They're massive like the stock export spec pumps, so fitting can be rather tricky. Thanks! Eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowboy bebop Posted April 17, 2008 Author Share Posted April 17, 2008 Here's a good quote from Ken Henderson, one of the most respected US members, My advice is do not mix up the elements, wiring and installation of various fuel systems with which pump is the best. Too many variables here. I just saw (in pics) what I thought was a pretty ghetto fuel system contained in a car from a respected board member. I've had two friends who are not members of this board lose motors like Terry McCamie because the Walbros took a shit on them. Not worth the risk, IMO, when you've already got the best pump available for high performance street cars (and you can have the best of both worlds as noted by SK VR4). Somewhere in my files, I also have the RC Engineering flow test comparisons of the Walbro and OEM pumps that I paid for several years ago working with John Cribb of [email protected], showing the OEM pump to be superior to the Walbro. I'd also like to know where all these references to stock pumps failing are. Other than a statement by Justin Nenni some time ago noting a stock pump failure, I have not been able to find any others. As noted in my original post, Walbro failures have become common. Ken. It's only a post on the net, but he does bring up some good points, Thanks! Eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homer Posted April 17, 2008 Share Posted April 17, 2008 I don't believe anyone has ever questioned whether the stock export spec pump is superior to the walbro, it's actually a well accepted fact here. The walbro's have always been FAR cheaper here than the export spec (which traditionally have been over £250 for a single pump) hence why most members go for the walbro when upgrading their fuel system. With a £120 or so price tag on a new, export spec pump, that more or less puts the walbro out of the market The thing that still makes me shudder is that people run multiple pumps without any detection/shut down system for a pump failure, that is just asking for trouble, no matter what pumps are used. They only have themselves to blame IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowboy bebop Posted April 17, 2008 Author Share Posted April 17, 2008 I don't believe anyone has ever questioned whether the stock export spec pump is superior to the walbro, it's actually a well accepted fact here. The walbro's have always been FAR cheaper here than the export spec (which traditionally have been over £250 for a single pump) hence why most members go for the walbro when upgrading their fuel system. With a £120 or so price tag on a new, export spec pump, that more or less puts the walbro out of the market The thing that still makes me shudder is that people run multiple pumps without any detection/shut down system for a pump failure, that is just asking for trouble, no matter what pumps are used. They only have themselves to blame IMO. You've got some good points there Homer. Eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bolarbag Posted April 18, 2008 Share Posted April 18, 2008 If you can supply me with two US spec Denso's at 125gbp each I'm in, forgive my ignorance but who are you, are you mvp or phr again? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowboy bebop Posted April 18, 2008 Author Share Posted April 18, 2008 I work very closely with MVP Motorsports. I really don't see that being a problem, sending the fuel pumps with the hanger, let me talk with Dusty about it so we're all on the same page. Thanks! Eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bolarbag Posted April 18, 2008 Share Posted April 18, 2008 Ask to him include the figures in the email I sent earlier cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowboy bebop Posted April 19, 2008 Author Share Posted April 19, 2008 If you can supply me with two US spec Denso's at 125gbp each I'm in, forgive my ignorance but who are you, are you mvp or phr again? Hi bolarbag, Two pumps for 125GBP each is a doen deal, we can supply that to you with the pump hanger. It's a lock. I'll edit the first post up as a general announcement, we can supply the US export spec Denso pumps with the hangers for 125GBP. It's the customers choice. Thanks! Eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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