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Thread: Starting issue

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    Me? Post? Never! Club Member Suprakeith's Avatar
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    Starting issue

    Right peeps am really could do with help and ideas to fix this issue,
    I will start at the beginning.....
    Have done forged na-t conversion and car was running fine but has noise from alternator as if something inside loose, so got new alternator and during fitting I didnít notice trickle charger wires were touching battery and the alternator power cable touched body work and caused short in loom as had little bit smoke.
    Checked original loom and was damaged so decided to buy new tweaked loom from USA.
    Fitted new loom and car wasnít turning over but everything else working fine so Inazone turned up and checked all fuses and relays and have 12volts where should and all earths are good, came to conclusion that could be ecu so fitted new link G4+ ecu and installed a base map.
    Now when try to start car get clicking noise from the injectors but engine still not turning over,
    We bridged the starter relay in fuse box and engine turned over like it should.
    But still getting nothing when turn key to start car.....

    My next idea is too remove dash and remove immobiliser from loom and check any damage to wires behind dash and try again, my thinking is as now know original ecu is damaged as was not getting any noise or anything from that when tried to start car, maybe the short has damaged immobiliser aswell as ecu.
    Also used the link software on laptop and am getting zero fault codes.

    So any ideas of what problem could be causing car not to turn over would be massive help please?
    94 Silver N/A Manual Supra

    Veilside Exhaust with de-cats,BC Racing Coilovers, Induction Kit,Bee R Rev Limiter, 75 Shot of NOS
    18 Inch TE Wheels,Bomex Front Bumper

    14.21 1/4 mile time (with NOS)
    Next on list: Sort and Tidy Bodywork

  2. #2
    BPU happy Events Organiser Shane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Suprakeith View Post
    Right peeps am really could do with help and ideas to fix this issue,
    I will start at the beginning.....
    Have done forged na-t conversion and car was running fine but has noise from alternator as if something inside loose, so got new alternator and during fitting I didn’t notice trickle charger wires were touching battery and the alternator power cable touched body work and caused short in loom as had little bit smoke.
    Checked original loom and was damaged so decided to buy new tweaked loom from USA.
    Fitted new loom and car wasn’t turning over but everything else working fine so Inazone turned up and checked all fuses and relays and have 12volts where should and all earths are good, came to conclusion that could be ecu so fitted new link G4+ ecu and installed a base map.
    Now when try to start car get clicking noise from the injectors but engine still not turning over,
    We bridged the starter relay in fuse box and engine turned over like it should.
    But still getting nothing when turn key to start car.....

    My next idea is too remove dash and remove immobiliser from loom and check any damage to wires behind dash and try again, my thinking is as now know original ecu is damaged as was not getting any noise or anything from that when tried to start car, maybe the short has damaged immobiliser aswell as ecu.
    Also used the link software on laptop and am getting zero fault codes.

    So any ideas of what problem could be causing car not to turn over would be massive help please?
    Pin 3 of the 8 pin connector BA1 down by the battery caries the trigger voltage for the start relay, when the key is turned to crank you should be seeing voltage here.

    Taken from Wilbo666
    JZA80 Toyota Supra 2JZ-GE 90980-10896 Engine Loom to Body Loom Plug [BA1]
    This plug is located inside the engine bay near the battery and mates with male connector 90980-10896. (BA1).

    Pin 3
    Engine ECU: STA
    (Engine ECU: NSW)
    Starter Motor Relay Trigger Signal
    Output
    The body loom side of this pin needs to be connected to the starter motor relay coil positive to turn the relay on when the ignition switch is in CRANK position (and the automatic transmission park / neutral switch is in the park / neutral position if the vehicle is equipped with an automatic transmission).

    Manual transmission: The engine loom side of this pin is connected in the engine wiring loom to the engine ECU STA pin, the engine ECU NSW pin and pin 7 of the engine loom to body plug 90980-11469.

    Automatic transmission: The engine loom side of this pin is connected to the automatic transmission park / neutral position switch and also the engine ECU STA pin.

    Refer to pin 7 of body loom plug 90980-11469 for further information.


    Hope that helps. Once you have established if that crancking voltage is there or not you should be able to determine whats going on pretty quickly. Presumably you can hear a relay click when you mobilise/imobilise?

    Also, if you scroll down to the first diagram (after all the pinouts) you can see how the starter circuit is wired.
    Last edited by Shane; 10-09-19 at 10:39.
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  3. #3
    Me? Post? Never! Club Member Suprakeith's Avatar
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    Thank you for that, will give that a try. We checked voltage from fuse box to starter and signal and were both fine, will try this and hopefully will be fine plus will also confirm new loom is correct.
    Not hearing any relays when arm or immobilise car but can hear the injectors and relays when try to start car
    94 Silver N/A Manual Supra

    Veilside Exhaust with de-cats,BC Racing Coilovers, Induction Kit,Bee R Rev Limiter, 75 Shot of NOS
    18 Inch TE Wheels,Bomex Front Bumper

    14.21 1/4 mile time (with NOS)
    Next on list: Sort and Tidy Bodywork

  4. #4
    BPU happy Events Organiser Shane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Suprakeith View Post
    Thank you for that, will give that a try. We checked voltage from fuse box to starter and signal and were both fine, will try this and hopefully will be fine plus will also confirm new loom is correct.
    Not hearing any relays when arm or immobilise car but can hear the injectors and relays when try to start car
    Sorry I got distracted at work and forgot to paste this in:

    http://wilbo666.pbworks.com/w/page/4...ngine%20Wiring

    So if you scroll all the way down past the pin out info to the first diagram, all the info you need to determine whats going on is there.
    Great minds discuss ideas, average minds discuss events, small minds discuss people.
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    Me? Post? Never! Club Member Suprakeith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shane View Post
    Sorry I got distracted at work and forgot to paste this in:

    http://wilbo666.pbworks.com/w/page/4...ngine%20Wiring

    So if you scroll all the way down past the pin out info to the first diagram, all the info you need to determine whats going on is there.
    Wicked thank you so much for that
    94 Silver N/A Manual Supra

    Veilside Exhaust with de-cats,BC Racing Coilovers, Induction Kit,Bee R Rev Limiter, 75 Shot of NOS
    18 Inch TE Wheels,Bomex Front Bumper

    14.21 1/4 mile time (with NOS)
    Next on list: Sort and Tidy Bodywork

  6. #6
    Me? Post? Never! Club Member Suprakeith's Avatar
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    Right still having problems with starting the car and looking for any other help or advice, have removed immobiliser and still no joy at all.
    Am wondering could it be my ignition control module thatís gone and causing issue? I have found spare in box but think itís from a Lexus as different part number from mine, just wondering if they are interchangeable?
    Am slowly running out of ideas and what to do next, only other option I thinking is making brand new loom just to start the car and have fuel pump, starter and ignition on switches on dash
    94 Silver N/A Manual Supra

    Veilside Exhaust with de-cats,BC Racing Coilovers, Induction Kit,Bee R Rev Limiter, 75 Shot of NOS
    18 Inch TE Wheels,Bomex Front Bumper

    14.21 1/4 mile time (with NOS)
    Next on list: Sort and Tidy Bodywork

  7. #7
    BPU happy Events Organiser Shane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Suprakeith View Post
    Right still having problems with starting the car and looking for any other help or advice, have removed immobiliser and still no joy at all.
    Am wondering could it be my ignition control module thatís gone and causing issue? I have found spare in box but think itís from a Lexus as different part number from mine, just wondering if they are interchangeable?
    Am slowly running out of ideas and what to do next, only other option I thinking is making brand new loom just to start the car and have fuel pump, starter and ignition on switches on dash
    Is it cranking now, i.e. is it turning over on the key?
    Great minds discuss ideas, average minds discuss events, small minds discuss people.
    Satin black BPU. 12.83 1/4 @ Santa Pod Saturday night special May 2015
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    Nissan Navara D22 twin cab PU,Mercedes W210 E300TD, W202 250TD powered by veggie oil,
    Vauxhall Tigra with Isuzu diesel engine conversion. Powered by veg oil

  8. #8
    Me? Post? Never! Club Member Suprakeith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shane View Post
    Is it cranking now, i.e. is it turning over on the key?
    No sheís still not turning over with the key
    94 Silver N/A Manual Supra

    Veilside Exhaust with de-cats,BC Racing Coilovers, Induction Kit,Bee R Rev Limiter, 75 Shot of NOS
    18 Inch TE Wheels,Bomex Front Bumper

    14.21 1/4 mile time (with NOS)
    Next on list: Sort and Tidy Bodywork

  9. #9
    extreme performance Club Member keron's Avatar
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    check the 120amp main fuse in the fuse box. also could be the silver ignitor pack on the pass suspension top or even the coil on the drivers inner wing. usually if the battery terminals cross, the 120amp fuse blows and the ignitor too ive found
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    Me? Post? Never! Club Member Suprakeith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by keron View Post
    check the 120amp main fuse in the fuse box. also could be the silver ignitor pack on the pass suspension top or even the coil on the drivers inner wing. usually if the battery terminals cross, the 120amp fuse blows and the ignitor too ive found
    I have checked 120amp fuse, have got spare ignition going to try that next the parts number isnít same as mine plus have spare coil but unsure if spare coil or ignition are any good, so if no joy may get working one from yourself just to sure as got to get her started soon
    94 Silver N/A Manual Supra

    Veilside Exhaust with de-cats,BC Racing Coilovers, Induction Kit,Bee R Rev Limiter, 75 Shot of NOS
    18 Inch TE Wheels,Bomex Front Bumper

    14.21 1/4 mile time (with NOS)
    Next on list: Sort and Tidy Bodywork

  11. #11
    Me? Post? Never! Club Member Suprakeith's Avatar
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    Just tired the spare ignition module and no change, but unsure if that unit is working as been in spare box for years.
    Have rechecked 120fuse and it looks fine but unsure if worth replacing.
    All I am getting is sound of relays and injectors after release key from turning it too firing position.
    Any other ideas or suggestions very welcome please
    94 Silver N/A Manual Supra

    Veilside Exhaust with de-cats,BC Racing Coilovers, Induction Kit,Bee R Rev Limiter, 75 Shot of NOS
    18 Inch TE Wheels,Bomex Front Bumper

    14.21 1/4 mile time (with NOS)
    Next on list: Sort and Tidy Bodywork

  12. #12
    BPU happy Events Organiser Shane's Avatar
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    Keith, use that circuit diagram systematically with multi meter or even a bulb on a bit of wire and you should be able to get it cranking pretty easily. But as a pointer, when you turn the ignition on, thats the point on the key before you hit the final crank position, you should hear both efi1 and efi2 relays click. try this first and then get back to me. Once we have established this we can move on to the next stage. I am only about 45 minutes from you but am really tied up with other stuff at the moment, working long days and often away so its not easy to come over. Possibly could come over for an hour or so one evening. I am sure we can get you a bit further without that though. So first, let me know if both, one or neither of those relays are being pulled please.
    Great minds discuss ideas, average minds discuss events, small minds discuss people.
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  13. #13
    Me? Post? Never! Club Member Suprakeith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shane View Post
    Keith, use that circuit diagram systematically with multi meter or even a bulb on a bit of wire and you should be able to get it cranking pretty easily. But as a pointer, when you turn the ignition on, thats the point on the key before you hit the final crank position, you should hear both efi1 and efi2 relays click. try this first and then get back to me. Once we have established this we can move on to the next stage. I am only about 45 minutes from you but am really tied up with other stuff at the moment, working long days and often away so its not easy to come over. Possibly could come over for an hour or so one evening. I am sure we can get you a bit further without that though. So first, let me know if both, one or neither of those relays are being pulled please.
    I will try that tomorrow evening and get back to you, will get misses to turn key while I listen, I did look at circuit diagram but donít understand it that much, have gotten Inazone from forum to check everything with multimeter as he understands them more than me.
    Would be massive help if one evening you were able to pop over and help and would happily pay you for your time as donít want to put you out mate.
    I am frustrated with it as have done the whole build myself more or less and one silly mistake and now canít get her to fire up now.
    94 Silver N/A Manual Supra

    Veilside Exhaust with de-cats,BC Racing Coilovers, Induction Kit,Bee R Rev Limiter, 75 Shot of NOS
    18 Inch TE Wheels,Bomex Front Bumper

    14.21 1/4 mile time (with NOS)
    Next on list: Sort and Tidy Bodywork

  14. #14
    BPU happy Events Organiser Shane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Suprakeith View Post
    I will try that tomorrow evening and get back to you, will get misses to turn key while I listen, I did look at circuit diagram but don’t understand it that much, have gotten Inazone from forum to check everything with multimeter as he understands them more than me.
    Would be massive help if one evening you were able to pop over and help and would happily pay you for your time as don’t want to put you out mate.
    I am frustrated with it as have done the whole build myself more or less and one silly mistake and now can’t get her to fire up now.
    OK, well stick a meter or even a small bulb between B+ pin on the diagnostic port and ground and when the ignition switch is in that position you should see voltage. Also, just to save a bit of time, look at pin 1 of BA3 connector when in cranking position, again between ground and that pin using a meter or small bulb. Forget getting it fired up for now, lets just concentrate on getting it cranking on the key first and then we can go from there.
    Last edited by Shane; Yesterday at 09:19. Reason: Pin/plug number transposed correction
    Great minds discuss ideas, average minds discuss events, small minds discuss people.
    Satin black BPU. 12.83 1/4 @ Santa Pod Saturday night special May 2015
    N/A auto, Red..Sold
    N/A Auto Silver..Sold

    Daily commute BMW E53 X5 M57 power
    Nissan Navara D22 twin cab PU,Mercedes W210 E300TD, W202 250TD powered by veggie oil,
    Vauxhall Tigra with Isuzu diesel engine conversion. Powered by veg oil

  15. #15
    Me? Post? Never! Club Member Suprakeith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shane View Post
    OK, well stick a meter or even a small bulb between B+ pin on the diagnostic port and ground and when the ignition switch is in that position you should see voltage. Also, just to save a bit of time, look at pin 1 of BA3 connector when in cranking position, again between ground and that pin using a meter or small bulb. Forget getting it fired up for now, lets just concentrate on getting it cranking on the key first and then we can go from there.
    Wicked thank you for help will make up small bulb circuit and give that try and let you know how get on.
    94 Silver N/A Manual Supra

    Veilside Exhaust with de-cats,BC Racing Coilovers, Induction Kit,Bee R Rev Limiter, 75 Shot of NOS
    18 Inch TE Wheels,Bomex Front Bumper

    14.21 1/4 mile time (with NOS)
    Next on list: Sort and Tidy Bodywork

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