Racelogic Traction Control

I know there are some Supra owners out there that have this system.

How easy or difficult is it to install? Do you just have to solder some wires to the ECU terminals or do you need to go into the engine bay and do some other tricky stuff?

More importantly how easy or difficult is it to set up and calibrate? I am being told that it takes at least a day to adjust it properly but this seems way too long (and expensive!) to me. Is it possible to do the setup and calibration yourself or do you need some fancy equipment for it?

I am interested in the adjustable system with launch control. Does anyone know the exact dimensions of the controller box (see picture below) so I can already figure out a decent place for it in the dashboard?

If it has to be installed by a professional can anyone recommend a good installer who can do a good deal on the system? Preferably near Harwich (ferry) or Folkestone (Eurotunnel) as I have to come over from Holland to have it installed.

Flavio

http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=1391042&a=10384032&p=49343075

There have been lots of good reports about this system. So much so that a couple of weeks ago my curiosity got the better of me and I ordered one of these units in order to find out more.

I'll be in a position to let you know exactly what is involved as soon as the unit arrives, which may possibly be next week.  

HTH,

J

Hi Ash,

Thanks for replying. Are you going to fit it yourself?

Flavio

Yes, that it correct. I'll be fitting it myself and setting up whatever it is that needs setting. Will post my findings as soon as I receive the unit.

Yours,

J

I just got news today (Mon, 4/6/01) that the unit I ordered will be delivered to me this week. Which means I should be in a position to give you a detailed report as to fitment by Friday or Saturday.

Yours,

J  

Allright, good luck with the installation, I look forward to your report.

Flavio

Okay, I got the unit and first impressions were the knob that controls the slippage looked like it had been taken from a 60's radio.

I haven't yet had chance to take a look at the fitting instructions but I will do over the weekend and let you know what is involved.

I'll be fitting a system to Justin's car first. We had a chat about it before he went on his hols and we agreed to junk the actual control box and integrate the slippage switch and the launch button into the RH dash panel. In other words, the wording such as "dry," "wet" etc. will be labelled on the actual surface of the dash panel. Thus making the whole thing look as stock as possible (which is always my yardstick).    

Speak to you soon,

J

JA - did the unit come with the same control box as pictured by Flavio in his first post above?

All the installs I have seen have had a seperate knob to control it and then the launch control located elswhere.

I have to admit the control knob really put me off the unit, it just looks a bit clunky sitting in the dash. It should be good to see the install in Js car.

JB

Yep, exactly the same as the one Flavio pictured above. So they seem to have changed their spec somewhat.

I'm not sure yet what I'm going to do with Justin's car. We painted the dash panels, so that gives much more scope for cutting and shutting. I might go the digital route and just have a simple up/down switch with a display alongside. Depends what I can find in the RS catalogue.

Yours,

J

what do you plan on doing to actually program the unit? I think Racelogic plug in a laptop and then accelerate as hard as possible to identify slip between the wheels and then work out the settings that way.

Did the unit come with full set up instructions? Just for my own info I would be interested to know where it taps into the abs sensors and how it taps into the ignition.

JB

Hi....

I put mine Racelogic control box in the glove compartment. I don't adjust it very often 5%-10% slip for dry days and 0% for wet no need to put it on display in my opinion.

Sorry Flavio and to you, Branners... I'm a bit pushed at the mo' but will let you know hopefully later today. My youngest nephew has just traded in his Punto for a Honda Accord and he's tugging my arm to fit his lowered springs, alloy wheels, induction kit exhaust and then he wants me to design a sound system, and a stage 2 head like Justin's, etc., etc. Then he wants a Honda bodykit... Bloody kids, who'd have 'em.   :)

Yours,

J

no problem, Im just interested to know as I do get asked at meets and stuff exactly how it works. I wont be buying one for quite a while yet unless I have a sudden influx of money. Next on my list has to be an EGT gauge and possibly oil temp as I need to know what my car is up to. It blew out the front crank oil seal at Bentwaters and Im not exactly sure why, so I need to keep an eye on things for a while.

JB

Okay, my nephew just phoned saying he'll be a bit late so I've had a close look at the unit and flipped through the manual.

The unit comes with a comm's lead and DOS software for the changing of the settings using a laptop computer. It comes with default settings which you can play with. The manual is very detailed and runs to some 80 pages. As to whether or not you'll find it difficult to program, Flavio, I'm not sure. If you already had a laptop, and you were fairly computer literate, then you wouldn't have any problems. But having default settings, ready programmed, will make it much easier to do.

Also, it mentions in the manual that the default settings may vary slightly to those printed... as they may have been optimised for the application. That kinda infers that Racelogic may already have tailored settings for the MKIV which they will let you have. Also, if there were another member with the same system, that had been optimised for the MKIV by Racelogic themselves, it would be very easy to read those settings using the comm's lead and software.  

Actual connection is made to the wiring loom in the region of the engine ECU (located in passenger footwell) and the ABS ECU (located behind head unit).

Connected to the engine ECU are 6 injector wires together with an RPM wire and plus & minus 12 volts. Connected to the ABS ECU are 4 x ABS wheel-sensor wires. So the electrical installation is just a case of knowing about basic wiring and how to solder. Plus, all the connections are made inside the car.  

Dimensions of the control box are: width 62mm; height 42mm and depth 25mm.    

On balance, if you know how to do basic wiring and can solder then you would find installation of the unit easy. The system comes with default settings so should work from the box.

It just occured to me to phone Racelogic, and they say the default settings of the unit will be pretty much optimum for a road-going MKIV TT.  

They also say, the only feature people generally change is the programmed slip percentage. By that I mean not the front panel slip percentage, but the actual underlying degree of slippage that is programmed into the unit's ECU which relates to the actual front-panel slip-switch position.

Racelogic say the reason why there are SO many programmable parameters, is because the units were designed to be used on all kinds of cars under all kinds of conditions.

They tell me race teams, for example, have different setups for different tracks and so forth. But the default settings are optimised for a typical fast road-going car such as the MKIV.  

Hope that answers everything.

Yours,

J

Hi Ash,

Thanks again for the detailed description. The only thing I would like to know still is what's inside the control box, is it just a switch, a LED and a pushbutton or is there a PCB inside?

From your description it looks like it is relatively easy to install yourself and I will do so. I have spoken to Racelogic UK as well and they can help with schematics for the Supra as well.

Let me know your settings and experience when you have actually installed the system. I am sure any MKIV owner would appreciate that.

Flavio

The control box contains a 6-position mechanical rotary switch; a single-pole mechanical push button and an ordinary red LED. All the electronics are contained within another box that measures 115mm x 98mm x 32mm in depth.

I'll be fitting it first to Justin's car so I am sure he'll have a lot to say about it.

Yours,

J

Ok the shop price sounds very tempting

I have read through the Race Logic pages, about their traction control system. All the detail refers to manual boxes.

What I can't find is how or if you can you get launch control on an automatic.

Would it be used in conjunction with power braking or would you have to tap into the auto box ECU.

You can't use the launch control exactly as it was intended to be used in the original Racelogic design with the stock torque convertor.

But the launch feature is a handy one to have because it allows a differing percentage of slippage under launch, and then modifies itself according to its internal program. I have only looked at the spec. sheets, and have yet to test the system on Justin's car. Naturally, I'll keep everyone informed of developments as they arise.  

Yours,

J

Hi Ash,

Did you install the TC on Justin's car yet? I will collect my TC tomorrow and will install it next Thursday. I would like to have the terminal schematics of the ABS and ECU computers so I know which wires to solder to. Can you be of assistance? Thanks.

Flavio

(Edited by Flavio at 9:32 pm on July 13, 2001)

Thanks Ash,

So I take it you are saying that it is worth having launch control on an auto anyway, even if you can't fully use the launch feature.

Would this mean you get little advantage in the dry, but greater advantages on loose and or damp surfaces.

What are the alternatives to the stock torque converter?

Can you not lower the launch control RPM to about 2500rpm and then you can have your foot flat on the floor with power braking?

JB

Shop!!

That sounds Ok

Just might need to fit a temperature sensor to the auto box cooler to monitor oil temperatures.

Phil...............

Alternatives to the stock torque convertor is to get one with a higher stall-speed. There are uprated ones available with stall-speeds as high as 4000 rpm. But they are mainly for drag use.

There is one that gives an increase of between 300 to 700 rpm (depending on the actual torque output of your engine) that would improve the launch of the stock car quite a bit, yet still remain driveable in normal traffic. Cost is in the region of £750 for the converter.

As for specifics regarding the Racelogic traction control, I'm not sure as all I've done to date is to read the spec. sheets. But will publish full results of testing the system, on Justin's car, some time soon.

Yours,

J

[i've just seen this "R/L trac control" thread on the techie forum so am copying a chunk from a post earlier today which is on the shoppie forum.]

What I am curious about is whether the launch control system is clever enough to allow the rear wheels to spin *enough* to keep the engine at high enough revs to keep the boost up.    If the system only lets the rear tyres spin a little bit initially , then this equates to the engine bogging down slightly.    

That's why getting a turbocharged car off the line is harder than an N/A car - if the engine drops off boost then it's slow, but if the rears spin too much this gives too many revs, too much boost and even more wheelspin.       Basically the torque curve on a turbo engine means that it's tricky to get right every time (especially 4 wheel drive cars).

For the anoraks amongst us, does anyone know EXACTLY what the launch control system does ?    once the clutch is dropped, rear wheel rpm equates directly to engine rpm, and as i say, the rears would have to have a lot of initial wheelspin to maintain engine rpm about peak torque which is 4800rpm on a UK car (like Eric Kasir's car and mine).

cheers

I believe it checks the rotation of the wheels in relation to each other, so if the rears are spinning much more than the fronts then it cuts in, with the adjustable slip you can choose just how much the wheels will spin before it cuts in.

JB