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Michelin Pilot Sport Cup 2 Tyres - Opinions


pedrosixfour
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Hey all.

 

Trying to decide on the road-legal track tyres I want to run next year on the track car.

 

Been looking at these tyres from Michelin and I was wondering if anyone has used them regularly at track days and if so what were the findings?

 

http://media.michelinman.com/content/dam/master/Michelin/tires/pilot-sport-cup-2/pilot_sport_cup_2_Persp.png

 

I always thought the addition of "Cup" to the model signified a track biased tyre from Michelin, with the minimum of features to meet legislation for road use.

 

However, Camskill have these tyres listed alongside the normal, everyday, road tyres one would use. There is no mention of them in the tack day tyre section at all. Any thoughts?

 

I was also considering a new set of 18" rims, 10" wide, front and rear, ET's +35. The Michelins would seem to be available in 2 sizes that would fit, 265/35 & 285/30.

 

From checking online calculators the 265 tyres would sit ever so slightly undersquare (or stretched) while the 285 tyres would be ever so slightly oversquare (or ballooned) on 10" wide rims.

 

Can anyone shed some light on whether I would be better of with a slight stretch or balloon with the Michelins in terms of ultimate grip? I would prefer to establish what would work best for short (20min) track sessions as Time Attack is my main interest and whatever sidewall aspect suits that format in terms of getting tyres to, and maintaining, their optimum working temperature for is definitely what I'd like to achieve.

 

Any thoughts or suggestions would be very welcome, as much as I like to think I know what I want, every time I go on a search I end up with so many decisions to make I just give up!

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The Neova are one of the listed tyres in the club class mate.

 

Tyres are what ultimately separate the classes in the Irish Time Attack series, club class must run a road legal tyre with a tread wear rating of at least 160 (if memory serves), pro class (my class) must run road legal tyre and unlimited is slick territory.

 

But your suggestion steered me towards the tread wear rating of the Michelin PS Cup2 which, it turns out, is 180. The same rating as the Yoko Neova. The original PS Cups were 80.

 

HOWEVER!! Looking at the club class regulations ALL PS Cup tyres, regardless of variant, are banned, which would lead you to believe that despite the increased wear rating the PS Cup2 are still considered too grippy for club class.

 

And just to make things even more interesting, it would also seem that going on tread wear ratings is like believing a VW won't poison everything within a four mile radius when the loud pedal is pressed. The tread wear rating is supplied by the tyre manufacturer and while it is prohibited to over rate a tyre's wear rate, there is nothing to stop the same producer from exploiting the loophole of under rating the wear rate of a tyre, meaning grippier tyres started finding their way into racing series with a particular tread wear limit. So basically comparing tread wear ratings is almost pointless!:rolleyes:

 

That's why I'm looking for real-world experiences with the PS Cup2 tyres, if they compared favourably to the original PS Cup tyres then I might take a chance on a set.

 

The Federal 595RS-R tyres I'm running now are ok, but nothing special. And if things go according to plan I'll be getting to corners in 2016 considerably quicker than I was in 2015. I'd like the tyres to be up to the jobs of braking, cornering and accelerating in keeping with this newly acquired level of oomph!

 

Oh and for reference the Federals have a 140 rating, as pointless as that number may be!

 

The Yokohama A048R tyres have a 60 rating, but are silly money, I mean fackin' ludicrous!

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I think that's fair enough when it is used as a control tyre mate, and everyone is dealing with the same grip levels.

 

But the only real regulation in my class is that the tyre is 'E' marked and readily available over the counter, so everyone is free to pick and choose the best tyre for them.

 

I just threw the Neova AD08R in there as they run them in Time attack in Japan lol Going to get them for mine , the thread looks cool too :p
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I will do Matt, cheers.

 

Have a look at the Porsche Caymen GT4 they run these tyres and i am guessing they are run the best way square or over/under

 

 

Update:

 

The front tyres are 245/35 on 20"x8.5" rims. That would appear to give the same sort of balloon profile as a 285/30 on a 18"x10".

 

The rears are 295/30 on 20"x11" rims. That would appear to give more of a stretch profile, but not quite as much as a 265/35 on an 18"x10" rim.

 

I had a thought that if I did run the same sized rims, front and rear, then running the 265's for a small stretch up front and the 285's for a slight balloon at the back might be the best option, but Porsche seem to crap all over that idea!

 

Then again, with the engine behind the brake lights for sixty years, what the feck do they know??:D

 

I realise the Cayman is mid-engine by the way.

Edited by pedrosixfour (see edit history)
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I have 285 on a 19 X 10.5 rim +7 and she can rub on a high compression suspension movement , my rear arches are 25mm wider each side

I will let you do the math lol , i am dropping back to a 275 like I had in there

 

More tyre width does not necessarily mean more grip ? Could you not start increasing the rolling resistance negating the benefit a wider tyre may bring?

 

I taught a 17 inch wheel would be best suited for optimum suspension performance

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I have the PSC2's on the GTR now, and they're simply fantastic. They're more grippy in the dry than the Pilot Super Sports but not quite as good in the wet.

 

If you're looking for the best road tyre for all out grip this side of an R888, then I'd go with the Pilot Sport Cup 2. Excellent tyre.

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More tyre width does not necessarily mean more grip ? Could you not start increasing the rolling resistance negating the benefit a wider tyre may bring?

 

I taught a 17 inch wheel would be best suited for optimum suspension performance

 

18 inch tyres are as cheap, if not cheaper, to buy than the 17 inch offerings. They also come in a greater selection of sizes, 255 is as wide as 17's can be sourced in now. Times and production have moved on from the 17" tyres, I have had to follow, albeit reluctantly.

 

I know what you're saying about bigger not necessarily leading to better. I have some 285/30 tyres on the rear now, wrapped around 18x9.75" (+30) rims, I might offer one up the a front hub and if they look like even an aggressive arch roll wouldn't suffice then I'll probably need to look at smaller sizes.

 

But don't worry about rolling resistance, I have that well and truly covered.:eyebrows:

 

I have the PSC2's on the GTR now, and they're simply fantastic. They're more grippy in the dry than the Pilot Super Sports but not quite as good in the wet.

 

If you're looking for the best road tyre for all out grip this side of an R888, then I'd go with the Pilot Sport Cup 2. Excellent tyre.

 

Thanks Johnny, a stout recommendation, given the car. It would appear that the original Cups are still available too, I know Chris Wilson is a fan of these, but the trouble is that the sizes seem to be very limited and when I look at what would interest me for some bloody reason the 295 tyres are €50 a corner cheaper than the 285's. I know €200 in my pocket won't mean much if the car is pitching & rolling around like a boat though.

 

I think to do things properly a track car with a good dry grip tyre set-up would really need a very good wet tyre option too, I'd be inclined to look at the best rated rain tyres available in 17" from the likes of Vredestein or Uniroyal, to be ready the Irish weather and all its charm. My local tyre depot would finally get something worthwhile out of me!

Edited by pedrosixfour (see edit history)
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18 inch tyres are as cheap, if not cheaper, to buy than the 17 inch offerings. They also come in a greater selection of sizes, 255 is as wide as 17's can be sourced in now. Times and production have moved on from the 17" tyres, I have had to follow, albeit reluctantly.

 

I know what you're saying about bigger not necessarily leading to better. I have some 285/30 tyres on the rear now, wrapped around 18x9.75" (+30) rims, I might offer one up the a front hub and if they look like even an aggressive arch roll wouldn't suffice then I'll probably need to look at smaller sizes.

 

But don't worry about rolling resistance, I have that well and truly covered.:eyebrows:

 

 

 

Thanks Johnny, a stout recommendation, given the car. I think to do things properly a track car with a good dry grip tyre set-up would really need a very good wet tyre option too, I'd be inclined to look at the best rated rain tyres available in 17" from the likes of Vredestein or Uniroyal, to be ready the Irish weather and all its charm. My local tyre depot would finally get something worthwhile out of me!

I would give the Michelin Pilot Super Sports some serious consideration if you're looking for an all rounder.

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Whilst Pilot Sport Cups are by far the best dry weather track day tyre that's road legal, if you have the opportunity to run a different tyre i the wet then take it. The Cup is a fairly hard compound, and has relatively poor wet weather capability. For truly wet you need something very soft with plenty of water clearing channels and sipes. Whilst nothing will come even remotely close to a proper race wet compound and pattern there will, for absolute certain be better wet weather road legal tyres for a wet Time Attack run, if you are allowed to switch and have free choice form all road tyres.

 

Best wet weather road tyre I ever tried was an old Uniroyal tyre, and they actually advertised them as "The Rain Tyre". Not sure how good they are these days, or if they even still make tyres. My days of spending any money on road cars are long gone!

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I would give the Michelin Pilot Super Sports some serious consideration if you're looking for an all rounder.

 

The days of compromise are over mate, this is an all-out assault on the 2016 title!!

 

Whilst Pilot Sport Cups are by far the best dry weather track day tyre that's road legal, if you have the opportunity to run a different tyre i the wet then take it. The Cup is a fairly hard compound, and has relatively poor wet weather capability. For truly wet you need something very soft with plenty of water clearing channels and sipes. Whilst nothing will come even remotely close to a proper race wet compound and pattern there will, for absolute certain be better wet weather road legal tyres for a wet Time Attack run, if you are allowed to switch and have free choice form all road tyres.

 

Best wet weather road tyre I ever tried was an old Uniroyal tyre, and they actually advertised them as "The Rain Tyre". Not sure how good they are these days, or if they even still make tyres. My days of spending any money on road cars are long gone!

 

Thanks for the input Chris, you've echoed what I said about running two different tyre types, depending on the weather on the day.

 

Would you have any thoughts on the 295/30/18 (original) Cup tyres being fitted to 10" rims for use on both axles?

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