Ceramic brake discs for a Supra. Worth it?

Hi guys,

I've been doing some market research and was interested in the idea of getting some ceramic brake discs for my Supra to go along with the other mods I have planned. Basically, if I want my car to be 800BHP plus, I want to have the suspension, brakes, damping exactly bang on so I can track it (and live with the modern stuff) as well as having the assurance that I can have consistent brakes that will never fade.

I've found a company in Germany called SICOM and they said they can custom build me some 360mm for my Supra. It's not cheap at just over £10,000 but they promise awesome performance. They had a test car in Germany which is a 911 GT2 RS which did 98 laps over a weekend at the Nurburgring and the pedal never went long!

These are the discs I had in mind

http://www.carbonceramicbrake.com/files/Product_Pictures/complete-Kit.jpg

An example of how they work on the E92 M3

https://scontent-lhr.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/10450829_1576862472537125_5420766102957258593_n.jpg?oh=ef7d0209a8161b4fafe3a5f6218b10fe&oe=55D30036

What do you guys all think?

Audi states its carbon-ceramic brakes last 183,000 miles, so I'd hope a weekend at the 'Ring would be easy!

Nice idea but the cost would put me off. I used Endless carbon pads and UK brakes on mine and that stood up to incredible abuse without fade.

May be contact "Bignum" on here as he uses his 600ish bhp Supra on track regularly, I think he uses stock uk calipers with uprated fluid and pads but perhaps he's found these are near the limit or he's never had issues etc.

First thoughts would be those brakes are overkill and fall into the money no object category and the money could be better used elsewhere?

£10k

Nice idea, and if money isnt an issue I'd go with it, can they guarantee they will fit without hassle? The last thing you want is for them to turn up from Germany and they dont fit. Also be careful with rim choice if you choose to go ahead with it.

Have you considered a Brembo brake setup?

These are bigger 4k cheaper and could easily get some brackets made up http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Original-Audi-RS4-B8-RS5-Carbon-Ceramic-Brakes-380x38mm-/281735743691?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item4198c248cb

These are bigger 4k cheaper and could easily get some brackets made up http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Original-Audi-RS4-B8-RS5-Carbon-Ceramic-Brakes-380x38mm-/281735743691?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item4198c248cb

I was going to say, a set of used R8 ceramic brakes with some brackets to fit would be a lot cheaper and they are incredible brakes.

I'd wait for Chris Wilson to comment, he's done some stuff for Wez's trackcar. And ManWithSupra will have some good info, too.

CCM's on a Supra, I think are a waste; you can only slow the car as much as the tyres will allow, mostly.

I'd wait for Chris Wilson to comment, he's done some stuff for Wez's trackcar. And ManWithSupra will have some good info, too.

 

CCM's on a Supra, I think are a waste; you can only slow the car as much as the tyres will allow, mostly.

True that , but I think he is looking from a brake fade point of view which is where these would way out do a steel setup not to mention 50% lighter unspring weight. I would not run a race carbon setup they probably would not stop at all when cold but carbon brakes like from the Audi which have been made for a road car I wouldn't see the problem with it.

True that , but I think he is looking from a brake fade point of view which is where these would way out do a steel setup not to mention 50% lighter unspring weight. I would not run a race carbon setup they probably would not stop at all when cold but carbon brakes like from the Audi which have been made for a road car I wouldn't see the problem with it.

A friends dad once test drove a 911 Turbo with the Carbon ceramic set up and he said from cold it is a little sketchy to the point he said he had a 'moment' before a corner. His final comment on the brakes was ' Rubbish when cold, Rip your face once warm'

True that , but I think he is looking from a brake fade point of view which is where these would way out do a steel setup not to mention 50% lighter unspring weight. I would not run a race carbon setup they probably would not stop at all when cold but carbon brakes like from the Audi which have been made for a road car I wouldn't see the problem with it.

I agree with the unsprung mass, but as was mentioned above, other members have tracked extensively without CCM's...

I agree with the unsprung mass, but as was mentioned above, other members have tracked extensively without CCM's...

Yea good point I guess track days are 15-25min sessions with 5-10laps these are probably overkill when a decent brembo or ap kit is more than enough

i recently painted a set of audi rs6 ceramic disc callipers and my god the callipers were very VERY heavy

i recently painted a set of audi rs6 ceramic disc callipers and my god the callipers were very VERY heavy

It's the discs that are 50% lighter

i recently painted a set of audi rs6 ceramic disc callipers and my god the callipers were very VERY heavy

Calipers are the same as an S5 but with modifed pads.

If you can afford to drop 10 grand on an upgrade where a grand will do the same job, go for it. Personally Id look for Brembo F50s, quality discs, pads and fluid.

Comment? £10K for Supra discs and calipers? Sorry I am speechless, what a waste of money per lap time saved.

Wasn't the Supra with the bigger UK brakes the fastest stopping car of all time until the carbon-ceramic braked Carrera GT came along?

£500 for some UK brakes that are exceptional or £10,000 to fix "muh fade". Hmm

Wasn't the Supra with the bigger UK brakes the fastest stopping car of all time until the carbon-ceramic braked Carrera GT came along?

 

£500 for some UK brakes that are exceptional or £10,000 to fix "muh fade". Hmm

Regular brakes are not going to be much good if I am planning regular tracks and running over 800bhp as planned.

Standard brakes are fine for a standard car. However for a racing car I want something far far more durable.

Whifbitz do a race brake kit that is made by AP Racing. That should be plenty for a race car, and will only be circa half the price of those. Use the change to buy some forged wheels, brilliant tyres and some Nitron shocks.

If you are hell bent on a ceramic setup I would be looking at something already off the shelf that can be made to fit, ie Porsche or Audi.

With a sensible head on I would be looking at proper floating discs and a caliper that could take a Performance Friction pad, job done

If I remember right, Axle (with his ongoing 3.4 build) was looking into Brembo ceramic brakes. You might have a look at his thread.

Yep, my GTS-t has Brembo front calipers from a Porsche 962 LM car, with quick release endurance pads. Discs are 380mm AP Racing, on floating alloy bells. Rears are Aston Martin calipers on none floating AP discs on alloy bells. Master cylinder set up is dual cylinders, With in car bias adjustment. remote servo on just the front brakes. Cost a fraction of 10K, and no fade and reasonable pad and disc wear.

Ceramic discs may reduce unsprung weight, but with road car suspension uprights and arms it's going to be pretty irrelevant.

I wouldn't worry about the 800BHP, the car will not have any real downforce, your wheel sizes will accommodate huge discs and calipers, and I'd be more concerned about keeping a genuine 800BHP engine cool over sequential laps than the brake set up. The thermal loadings from 800BHP are far from trivial. Look what Buggatti had to do for a true 1000BHP car, the things nearly all heat exchangers

Cost a fraction of 10K

£10K for a taxi's brakes? I'm speechless!

I have a friend who had a Porsche 991 TurboS with the optional ceramic brakes.

He did a lot of track days with the Porsche, and had killed the discs and pads within less than 1 year. They charged him 2000 EUR per brake disc and 1200 EUR for the pads ; that made a total of 10.000 EUR of parts.

He sold the TurboS quickly after that and bought a 991 GT3, but didn't take the optional ceramic brakes.

He told me that on track (he does regularly Nurburgring, SPA, etc), he didn't feel any noticeable difference between the ceramics and the standard Porsche steel brakes. He changed his discs and pads recently on the GT3, and the prices were A LOT less !