UK & US Tuning

I'm fairly new to the Supra fold, however have been involved with Skylines, Subaru's, Evo's etc for a very long time.

Now with the other car's there is a more or less a universal sort of tuning maximum throughout the globe on standard internals. You may get one or two anomalies however the consensus is uniformed.

Now one thing I have noticed with Supra's is the pretty big difference on how far US Owners/Tuners will take stock internal supra's up to, power wise, in comparison to UK Owners/Tuners.

From my research it seems that here in the UK anything above 650bhp it's recommended to uprate internals, however across the pond the consensus is that the standard block can take well up to 7-800 whp before you have to uprate. I know for sure that at least one guy has hit the 9's on standard internals, and the car was pretty reliable at that point.

Although I know the US hp figures can be a little dubious and more similar to our crank figures, however even then the difference is pretty big.

Is this down to us being a little more conservative on this side of the world, or have people gone out and actually seen how much the block can take before breaking.

Longevity is a factor, however I believe longevity for a big hp car should be around 5-6k miles per year.

Why do you guys think it is?

Are they tuning their car's any different or is it just down to them riding their luck?....

The yanks mainly use dynojet dynos which do read high when compared to our dyno's.

Id imagine they can handle that sort of power but for how long? with the sort of roads we have who wants a 1000bhp lag monster that only comes to life at silly speeds on big dual carriage ways and motorways? different if you are building a drag car.

i think you hit the nail on the head with "Is this down to us being a little more conservative on this side of the world" this side of the pond 550-600 i think is realistic, of all the Japanese engines in this type of vehicle they are without doubt the strongest and even Skyline tuners would begrudgingly accept that, however they are'nt getting any younger

I would like to see someone Europe side go 800bhp+ on a stock block, yes it may take a dyno run of that power but it's doughtful it'll last long, that said I don't think I've seen anyone this side try

How many of these 800rwhp 9 second monsters are using 99 ron octane fuel and operating at their maximum claimed boost when away from the dyno or drag strip?

Also as you mention longevity, how long are these 'stockers' lasting? I have no intention of ever requiring a rebuild unless I chose to upgrade the internals so regardless of have a stock or a built engine if that thing needs to be opened up then imo it can't handle the chosen power.

I think some of, if not most run on E85, and other mixes that bring their 93 ron up to 100+.

I think your right gaz by saying if it blows it cannot handle the power, however in some cases if a built block blows, it doesn't necessarily indicate that the built block couldn't handle it. It could have been run on the wrong fuel or abused some how.

And your other point about the boost is also interesting, as they probably do run it lower, however it is also interesting to see them ran at the highest boost levels when the engines under the most stress, drag etc...

I think it is accepted that in stock form no Japanese engines can touch the strength of the 2JZGTE, however no even some Skyline tuners are venturing further and further with stock internals. R.I.P.S Are leading the way there and over time the UK tuners are following the same direction.

The same thing happened in the UK Subaru scene a while back, whereas previously stock STI blocks were not taken over 350ish, in recent times many take them up to 440ish without issues.

Jamie I also agree with you that our roads couldn't handle a power monster as big as that kind, and maybe that's why no-one has bothered.

However it still is interesting in the differences across the continents.

I think that maybe the Supra tuning field in the UK is extremely advanced especially with people like Whifbitz breaking barriers by entering competitive cars into TA, and building bigger and better cars each year. As said it would be nice to a see a UK car get their one day, but when I think will probably be a different matter...

Have the roads got anything to do with it?

From what I've seen, American roads tend to be long, straight, wide and smoothe. UK roads tend to be not so long, bendy, narrow and crumbled! The Yanks use huge singles and have the roads to get the most out of it, but here we tend to go for mainly BPU and a good all round set up, especially handling wise, for those twisties.

So maybe we don't need to uprate the internals as we don't need to, and those who do just want better performance, and it has nothing to do with how much the block can take?

Yes US roads are massive in comparison to the roads here.

My cousins came over from NY, and were amazed at how "tight" the roads were around London.

Would be good to see some high powered cars running on stock internals though.

I have a big project in mind for early next year, will be getting most of the work through Whifbitz, and maybe I'll see how far I can take it before we upgrade...

Time will tell

Would be good to see some high powered cars running on stock internals though.

Why ?, i struggle to see what this interest with the "russian roulette" approach to tuning is, i am rebuilding an engine at present because i realise even at my fairly low (in single terms) 500hp my 16 year old motor is not going to last indefinately, i really would not be impressed with anyone coming on this forum and claiming 700-800hp on a stock motor thats at least 10years old, my view would be "more fool you" and i think anyone doing this in the UK on this forum would probably come in for some justifiable flak

I think i once remember a US tuner saying "You can have 800-1000hp on stock internals on a dyno, but a dyno will never simulate the conditions that you would get on a road, with all the other factors involved". Have 800hp on a dyno may lead to 650hp on the road because after achieving those figures on a dyno, it would have to be re-adjusted to accomodate for every day driving.

The difference can be summarised thusly... We're right, they're wrong.

Why ?, i struggle to see what this interest with the "russian roulette" approach to tuning is, i am rebuilding an engine at present because i realise even at my fairly low (in single terms) 500hp my 16 year old motor is not going to last indefinately, i really would not be impressed with anyone coming on this forum and claiming 700-800hp on a stock motor thats at least 10years old, my view would be "more fool you" and i think anyone doing this in the UK on this forum would probably come in for some justifiable flak

I think it's more a development into the tuning world. I mean years ago without people taking stock blocks to 500+ how would we have known that the blocks can take this safely.

Reaching new boundaries in the tuning industry is not about "impressing" any one individual, rather exploring the boundaries of tuning within the marque that we all have a vivid interest in.

Why would there be any need for any flak? I'm sure when the 1st Supra with over 600 on the stock block was achieved it wasn't renounced at all, and actually a new milestone being achieved in the world of UK Supra tuning was celebrated.

It was just interesting to see the two different views, as said from the previous marques I have come from there is a universal sort of "known" boundary, with the Supra being the only one with differing views.

I think Micheal may have hit the nail on the head though, it probably makes sense for them to detune the car's for the road, maybe we're just alot more honest over here!