Ominous signs of GT4088R failure

I've currently got my Supe at MS getting the manifold re-heatwrapped. They've got my turbo off so I took the opportunity to inspect the turbine blades.

Although nowhere near as bad as mine & others fully damaged ones, the initial signs of a couple of the blade edges being nibbled are definately there.

I have never run 2 Step on this one & my EGT's have never been over 950 (and I now measure temps pre turbo).

I didn't get a chance to take any pictures but I'm pleased I've taken the decision to leave this turbo.

Do seem a tad weak don't they? I personally wouldn't risk fitting one. Too many good units out there.

Sorry to hear about another one Jay

Still, its not just common to the 4088's... here's a recent picture of my t67, not looking too healthy.

This turbo has only seen 1.1bar and very little Wot on my car, maybe 5000miles, 98% being off boost motorway miles. I've not noticed any difference in performance, so i'm not in any rush to change it.

Do seem a tad weak don't they? I personally wouldn't risk fitting one. Too many good units out there.

Yeay, I wouldn't get another

Sorry to hear about another one Jay

Still, its not just common to the 4088's... here's a recent picture of my t67, not looking too healthy.

This turbo has only seen 1.1bar and very little Wot on my car, maybe 5000miles, 98% being off boost motorway miles. I've not noticed any difference in performance, so i'm not in any rush to change it.

Wow Mart, that looks pretty well ****ed too I would never have known my 1st one had gone either just by the lack of performance

Is that a Garret T67?

How do they end up like that after so few miles when oem turbos last 100k miles and don't look half as bad?

Not good

Looks like they are not able to handle the heat.

Do seem a tad weak don't they? I personally wouldn't risk fitting one. Too many good units out there.

What is the best all round turbo then? i really liked the idea of having one of these one day. Say a Turbo that is set up for 500hp that spools up fast, very little lag etc? for a road car with the odd track day. No drag strips.....

thanks

Hasn't it be determined that the 4088 is a truck turbo (originally)... Being diesel, they run MUCH lower EGTs. I'd hazard a guess they are just heat burning the edges and it just goes from there....

This is a GT4088R though

i thought the "r" just meant water cooled

i thought the "r" just meant water cooled

And dual ball bearing

Water cooling and ball bearing wouldn't stop heat on the edge of the turbine blades.

Water cooling and ball bearing wouldn't stop heat on the edge of the turbine blades.

Yeah I know , but it's in Garretts latest GT roller bearing lineup along with the well praised GT35R, GT42R etc, but we don't hear about those failing, I doubt Garrett would use a different design/material on a turbo in the middle of it's lineup, or maybe they would , either way I migt just turn the anti-lag on this one for 6 months now & have some fun

Has anyone actually contacted Garrett with pics of turbos that have failed in the same way on different cars?

I spoke to Turbo Technics, or maybe it was Turbo Dynamics about this an the response was that the only difference between the petrol and the diesel version was the exhaust turbine housing, the rest is all the same, and it was thought that the only possibility for this damage was down to the housing distorting and touching the blades, doesn't sound right to me as the damage look to irregular.

I still think it is a cavitation effect. Will have to brush up on this but it was common on lower revving turbines operating in denser mediums. I will have to exercise the brain a bit and do some research before saying anymore

If this is down to cavitation effect , then how come it only effects these turbos, if the material for the exhaust turbines are all the same for all the Garrett range?

Simple answer to that is that I don't know. But whatever effect it is, cavitation or other, that is causing this, it is only happening on this turbo.

You know what Marty's pic looks like to me? Turbine creep. This used to happen on gas turbine engines when the turbine material overtemps, stretches and rubs on the turbine casing. If you look at the pic you can see hot spots on each blade and only in that area the edges have been torn off. I reckon thats a valid theory...

Wouldn't you expect creep to be more uniform though?

They all seem to be the DBB type dont they? The bearings could be giving way at the 130K rpm or whatever they spin at, and under the intense heat - any effect of expansion on the turbine blades due to the heat would take them closer to the turbine housing

The fact that its not uniform would enhance this theory as bearings giving way would create a spontaneous movement of the shaft, the compressor would be in a better condition as both the comp housing and compressor blades are under less heat

Does anyone run water injection and their turbos suffer the same fate? Maybe its just too much timing retard for the material

Nobody has had any evidence of bearing failure though? Having difficulty thinking about htis, 20 years since I was doing any of this.

Any evidence on the inside of the housing of the blade touching? My turbine still looks like new although I use meth injection.

Any evidence on the inside of the housing of the blade touching? My turbine still looks like new although I use meth injection.

And this car sees track action

I run water injection also