Power fc over emu

I was going to run an emu on my uk single, actually got 1 now, but ive got the chance to get a power fc, is their any advantage with the power fc against a well setup emu, cheers.

I would have imagined so. Isn't a power FC a full on ECU, and not just something that fudges signals.

I would have imagined you'd get a much better map with alot more adjusting ability with the Power FC.

You can also monitor alsorts of things with them, like oil pressure, temperatures. Alsorts of stuff like that. You might need extra sensors for it though.

A mate of mine works for RB motorsport, and he had a power FC in both his RB5 Impreza and his R32 GTR. So they must be pretty good.

I am no expert on this but from reading about them that's the impression I get.

I think the Power FC is a great bit of kit teamed up with mapping from Ryan G

Ditch the piggy back mate

Very different choices:

Power FC

http://www.chriswilson.tv/compare/fc.jpg

or

Well set up emu

http://www.chriswilson.tv/compare/emu.jpg

Very different choices:

 

Power FC

 

http://www.chriswilson.tv/compare/fc.jpg

 

or

 

Well set up emu

 

http://www.chriswilson.tv/compare/emu.jpg

hahahahhahaa, that has made my day...

Nobody is going to nick the car with the EMU installed inside

Lol

Very different choices:

 

Power FC

 

http://www.chriswilson.tv/compare/fc.jpg

 

or

 

Well set up emu

 

http://www.chriswilson.tv/compare/emu.jpg

Nice one Chris......very amusing *snigger*

Actually as for the map resolution thers not a vast difference, but you do have total control of most engine feedback parameters, however I'm not 100% on whether there is a specific PFC for the UK model??

if your going to get it mapped by a professional, no problem, but if you want to do it yourself, then TBH you need Datalogit software, as the hand commander is a real pain for anything but small adjustments.

Very different choices:

 

Power FC

 

http://www.chriswilson.tv/compare/fc.jpg

 

or

 

Well set up emu

 

http://www.chriswilson.tv/compare/emu.jpg

I never knew aquamist could be run from a EMU

I never knew aquamist could be run from a EMU

LOL But an interesting point;) PFC cant run WI but EMU can.

Love that chris,

These types of questions are always going to create mixed opinions as sometime the budget plays a key factor in the wanted answer.

A full standalone Ecu is always going to come on tops in this argument of which is better but like anything in the wrong hands a product can become shamed.

I think of a Powerfc as kind of an in the middle ecu as all though it is fully standalone, very reliable and perfect for any supra (Not Auto’s). It is not as advanced as say a Motec M600 +, Link G3 Plus, Autronic or an Aem with the added features they hold.

I recommend them a lot though due the fact that they come out most of the time a lot cheaper for buying and mapping but still create the final result.

If an owner has just a BPU Supra and they want to keep it that way and gain abit of HP at the top end plus remove some of the nasty spikes of det which occur on the turbo change point then honestly I would 99% of the time point them in IanC’s direction as I have done many times as in the right hands it can be very good. I could not sleep at night unlike another mapper I know making a BPU owner pay 3K for an AEM, DLI, decat and mapping only to gain 30bhp and run like crap.

But if you are thinking of going single then the Powerfc wins hands down especially with the commandor and knock light setup. Sorry Ian

PFC cant run WI but EMU can.

It can with the datalogit

Not all power fc are middle of the road Ryan;)

Whats the map resolution on the E.M.U?

Whats the map resolution on the E.M.U?

16x16 iirc

It has a few tables, all 16*16 unless they are simple trim tables:

Airflow adjust

Injector control

Road speed fuel adjust

Ignition adjust

Acceleration injector adjustment map

Acceleration ignition adjustment map

Auxilary switched output (yes, a 16*16 map for your WI or nitrous needs )

Trim tables and other funky stuff:

Water temp fuel adjust

Intake temp fuel adjust

Water temp ignition adjust

Intake temp ignition adjust

Rev limit defeater

Speed convertor

delimiter

Fuel cut remover

MAF to MAP conversion with autopopulation

Target AFR mapping

Additional injector control (can also drive NOS or a WI solenoid etc)

Datalogging of everything through software @20ms

Datalogging of 8 channels onboard @20ms

Things that are just daft or don't really work on a Supra:

Anti engine stall (for MAF and atmo BOV combination)

Various VTEC stuff

Individual cylinder fuel and ignition trims

Idle adjustment

you get the idea, it's the pinnacle of signal fudgers - compare that lot to a MAP2 and make your own mind up

So ian youve got these sorted on uk`s then.

It can with the datalogit

Really! have they changed it now? never used to be able to, mind you its 2 years since i had one.

Ian i am using the ign and fuel individual adjustment maps, as a little insurance, why do you say that they are just daft or don't really work on a Supra?

Mind you i can't categorically say that they do either, but can be quite useful for safeguarding the rear cylinder temps/det etc.

Thanks Ian.

Do many of the Supra boys use the HKS Fcon or is it more EMU's and AEM? I know there's not a lot of UK mappers for the Fcon, probably why the PowerFC is a big hit with the Skylines unless you live local to a "power writer."

Sorry for the hijack Gents and thanks for the info.

 

Ian i am using the ign and fuel individual adjustment maps, as a little insurance, why do you say that they are just daft or don't really work on a Supra?

Mind you i can't categorically say that they do either, but can be quite useful for safeguarding the rear cylinder temps/det etc.

I think it's daft because:

1) If you need to trim individual cylinders it isn't going to be by much otherwise there is a bigger problem with your injectors or compression etc

2) If the trimming is tiny then the gains will be tinier

3) If something causes problems with no trim and a tiny trim stops the problem (det for example) then you are on the raggedy edge anyway

4) If you can measure the tiny differences then I'd assume you have a) and EGT probe in each exhaust runner, b) a wideband sensor for each runner (somehow!) and c) some way of detecting which individual cylinder is detting

5) If you need 2) and 3) and have 4) wtf are you doing pissing about with an E-Manage, get a full race Motec already! Clearly you are in a competitive race series

If you are doing 1) without 4), how do you know what to trim them by?

Like I said, it's daft. Overblown for the unit and it's target applications. Like a pizza oven that can be set to the nearest 0.1degC.

-Ian

I think it's daft because:

1) If you need to trim individual cylinders it isn't going to be by much otherwise there is a bigger problem with your injectors or compression etc

2) If the trimming is tiny then the gains will be tinier

3) If something causes problems with no trim and a tiny trim stops the problem (det for example) then you are on the raggedy edge anyway

4) If you can measure the tiny differences then I'd assume you have a) and EGT probe in each exhaust runner, b) a wideband sensor for each runner (somehow!) and c) some way of detecting which individual cylinder is detting

5) If you need 2) and 3) and have 4) wtf are you doing pissing about with an E-Manage, get a full race Motec already! Clearly you are in a competitive race series

 

If you are doing 1) without 4), how do you know what to trim them by?

 

Like I said, it's daft. Overblown for the unit and it's target applications. Like a pizza oven that can be set to the nearest 0.1degC.

 

-Ian

Nice post Ian, if you don't mind me saying so? I concur 100%

I actually thought Ian, i might get a sensible friendly exchange, rather than the pedantic scathing response that you seem to dispense to anyone who displays a little knowledge when it comes to Emanage, it almost like you seem threatened by anyone else who also knows what there about, and try and belittle them for it, or is it just me!i must admit i am getting a little sick of this attitude, mapping emanage is not a dark art or rocket science you know:rolleyes:

Anyway as i said i have used the water temp adjustment setting to add a little duty cycle at high temps/high RPM, same goes for ign a degree or two of timing in the same areas,

also pulled a degree of timing from no 5 and 6 at high RPM,

Now like i said in the first instance, this is tiny amounts and only as a kind of extra insurance, i don't have any problems that need the adjustments, nor do i see them as causing any problems,

Cant you prove that these adjustments make no difference, if they are useless then why do stand alone ECUs also have the same features?

i have been playing around with Emanage and PFC on several different cars for the last four years and i haven't blown up or damaged any of them, i have also achieved some very good gains in BHP and torque, and got my Silvia from 197BHP to 325 with just a turbo (not large, same boost) and cam swap, so i don't think my mapping skills are to shoddy! unlike you i just don't map other peoples cars and charge for it, but i could;)

Come on guys lets keep this friendly. Not everyone is going to agree on every subject but it is good to throw in 2 sides to make a discussion.

I just want to add my 2p worths to this subject.

Funny enough I always add abit of extra fuel to the 4th, 5th and 6th cylinder on all the standalones. Most of the time it is 4th – 1%, 5th – 2% and 6th – 3%.

Why you ask?

Ok basically a while back I had a chat with Mark @ Phoenix to see which cylinder was a popular one for chewing a HG or eating a Ring as every engine has its favourites (E.G 3sgte’s like the centre ones due to the intake manifold design, Tested with EGT Probes)

He mentioned that the favourites were normally 5th and 6th as they tend to run hotter at the back.

Now thinking about it, did the Uk Spec’s add a bonnet vent directly above these cylinders to keep these cylinders cooler?

Also 2 of the standalones I map on supra’s have the ability to log each knock sensor on the block and the one at the back is always the one when I pickup any slight pre det through the cans it is 9/10 that sensor which logs to noise.

Ryan